Originally Posted by Denny Crane

I'm not a numbers kind of guy and everyones number is different based on what they had earned up to the bankruptcy and freezing then termination of the pension. Frankly I believe myself and anyone else in my position is SOL as far as getting any payback. I just want the younger folk to realize the magnitude of the losses. In my case I had an earned benefit at age 60 of $7800/month. If I retired at age 60 now and started taking my PBGC, I'd get $3800/month. 4000x12=48000x25(years)=1,200,000 dollars. Yes, there are other factors that will reduce that amount but, on the whole, I'm losing about a million over my lifetime (85). Mother died at 78 and father still alive at 92.

Originally Posted by Denny Crane

I'm not a numbers kind of guy and everyones number is different based on what they had earned up to the bankruptcy and freezing then termination of the pension. Frankly I believe myself and anyone else in my position is SOL as far as getting any payback. I just want the younger folk to realize the magnitude of the losses. In my case I had an earned benefit at age 60 of $7800/month. If I retired at age 60 now and started taking my PBGC, I'd get $3800/month. 4000x12=48000x25(years)=1,200,000 dollars. Yes, there are other factors that will reduce that amount but, on the whole, I'm losing about a million over my lifetime (85). Mother died at 78 and father still alive at 92.

As I've said before, I'll be okay in retirement. But the idea of having forfeited that much money does kinda rankle me. I'm not losing any sleep etc and I believe I have a pretty good attitude...........but, when I think about it, I just shake my head.

Maybe I'm wrong, but sometimes I get the impression that pilots that didn't participate in the DB at the time don't realize that this was deferred compensation. It was mentioned by someone that the contract can change and he is right it did. I got no problem with that. The problem is that you shouldn't be able to take away a benefit that was earned under previous contracts. Unfortunately that's exactly what happened in bankruptcy. C'est la vie.

Personally I think that the company should follow it's rules of the road and make good on their retirement promises for ALL participants in the DB plan up until the time it was terminated. I think they should do this without affecting our contract or negotiations. Determining how much each participant should get is waaaaaay above my pay grade but I'm sure there are ways to figure that out. I know, a pipe dream.

Denny

Originally Posted by m3113n1a1

So you're 4k short of what you should be being paid. So you need 1.2 million in your 401k to theoretically safely withdraw 48k a year to supplement your pension. This should be achievable for most pilots since bankruptcy right?

However, I think that 7800 a month is still a bit low for people who have been making 250k+ for the last few years!

Edit: tennisguru beat me to it

Originally Posted by PilotJ3

True but, at that time, his/her major debts should be payed off. So 93k + social security + savings, should be enough for a comfortable life.

Retirement is another phase of life. And like everything on life, one must adjust to it.

Originally Posted by sailingfun

At a minimum most people require 70% of their pre retirement income to maintain the same quality of life.

Originally Posted by 2StgTurbine

That statistic is meant for the general public, not people making $300,000 or more.

By the time I retire I will have no debt, any kids will be paying their own bills, and I would have already bought most of the toys I want to play with in retirement. $100,000 a year is plenty for that.

Originally Posted by m3113n1a1

So you're 4k short of what you should be being paid. So you need 1.2 million in your 401k to theoretically safely withdraw 48k a year to supplement your pension. This should be achievable for most pilots since bankruptcy right?

However, I think that 7800 a month is still a bit low for people who have been making 250k+ for the last few years!

Edit: tennisguru beat me to it

Originally Posted by PilotJ3

True but, at that time, his/her major debts should be payed off. So 93k + social security + savings, should be enough for a comfortable life.

Retirement is another phase of life. And like everything on life, one must adjust to it.

Originally Posted by TED74

I hear this a lot. Is that really the way it went down? Could be...I wasn't there.

When I got hired, I was told the PWA determines my compensation, and the PWA is continually rewritten by negotiation. I've never been promised I will get 16% DC in perpetuity.

Originally Posted by Peoloto

Ehhh, semi similar. There are differences more than the name. Like the fact it's in your name and you have control over it. It can go away and we all understand that risk. You guys on the other hand seem to have failed to understand that.