Pilots Extending
12-14-2019, 06:50 AM
#1
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Joined APC: Dec 2007
Position: DAL 330
Posts: 6,870
Pilots Extending
I thought this issue deserved its own thread.
As was previously said this update was much better than the “War on Greenslips” update. First a War on Christmas, now a war on GS’s. Is nothing sacred anymore.
From the update:
Comparing the total number of FDPs, Delta pilots extend 5.2 times more often than Southwest, 2.6 times more often than American, and 1.8 times more often than United. Comparing the extension-to-departures ratio, Delta pilots extend 7 times more often than Southwest, nearly 3 times more often than American, and 1.5 times more often than UAL.
It’s going to be pretty amusing to see the DAL can do wrong crowd spin this data.
Scoop
As was previously said this update was much better than the “War on Greenslips” update. First a War on Christmas, now a war on GS’s. Is nothing sacred anymore.
From the update:
Comparing the total number of FDPs, Delta pilots extend 5.2 times more often than Southwest, 2.6 times more often than American, and 1.8 times more often than United. Comparing the extension-to-departures ratio, Delta pilots extend 7 times more often than Southwest, nearly 3 times more often than American, and 1.5 times more often than UAL.
It’s going to be pretty amusing to see the DAL can do wrong crowd spin this data.
Scoop
12-14-2019, 07:43 AM
#2
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Dec 2007
Posts: 5,414
This was a fantastic update and will lead interesting debates about the culture and psychology of Delta pilots, along with management practices that induce extensions. One flight this summer had an AA pilot on the jumpseat thank us for extending because they never extend
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12-14-2019, 08:13 AM
#3
Roll’n Thunder
Joined APC: Oct 2009
Position: Pilot
Posts: 3,557
It's all very situational. I extended once this summer because we dutied on at noon but due to storms our plane hadn't left ATL yet. So we just stayed at the hotel all day. Got in a workout, had a nice dinner, finally headed to the airport because the hotel needed our rooms that night. Pushed off the gate at midnight, after 12 hours "on duty". Now had they been leg 4 or 5 and dealing with weather all day I doubt I would have extended.
12-14-2019, 08:41 AM
#4
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Joined APC: Jul 2006
Position: The Right One
Posts: 588
Pilots Extending
I have extended several times in the past 5 years at Delta. Each time, WITHOUT EXCEPTION, when it was over, in hindsight I have regretted it. I never felt pressured by the company, I did it to myself. Not going to do it again.
Physiologically, Fatigue is like being drunk, it’s virtually impossible to self diagnose when you have had too much to operate safely.
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Physiologically, Fatigue is like being drunk, it’s virtually impossible to self diagnose when you have had too much to operate safely.
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12-14-2019, 08:54 AM
#5
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Joined APC: Oct 2017
Posts: 52
Originally Posted by SabreDriver
I have extended several times in the past 5 years at Delta. Each time, WITHOUT EXCEPTION, when it was over, in hindsight I have regretted it. I never felt pressured by the company, I did it to myself. Not going to do it again.
Physiologically, Fatigue is like being drunk, it’s virtually impossible to self diagnose when you have had too much to operate safely.
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Physiologically, Fatigue is like being drunk, it’s virtually impossible to self diagnose when you have had too much to operate safely.
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
I remember one day struggling to do the math on my duty day, thinking I was already out of time. I called scheduling to verify and they went through the math and showed I was off. I told them if I was too fatigued to add, I probably shouldn’t be operating airliners.
12-14-2019, 08:55 AM
#6
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Joined APC: Oct 2009
Posts: 3,108
Originally Posted by SabreDriver
I have extended several times in the past 5 years at Delta. Each time, WITHOUT EXCEPTION, when it was over, in hindsight I have regretted it. I never felt pressured by the company, I did it to myself. Not going to do it again.
Physiologically, Fatigue is like being drunk, it’s virtually impossible to self diagnose when you have had too much to operate safely.
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Physiologically, Fatigue is like being drunk, it’s virtually impossible to self diagnose when you have had too much to operate safely.
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
As professionals with hundreds of lives in our hands, the risk is not worth the reward.
The risk is a $1 Billion dollar hull loss and the reward is not visible in our revenue or profits.
At the very least the policy needs to be no questions asked. Period.
The hoops we have to jump through is pilot pushing pure and simple.
12-14-2019, 09:12 AM
#7
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Joined APC: Dec 2007
Position: DAL 330
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Originally Posted by tennisguru
It's all very situational. I extended once this summer because we dutied on at noon but due to storms our plane hadn't left ATL yet. So we just stayed at the hotel all day. Got in a workout, had a nice dinner, finally headed to the airport because the hotel needed our rooms that night. Pushed off the gate at midnight, after 12 hours "on duty". Now had they been leg 4 or 5 and dealing with weather all day I doubt I would have extended.
The numbers above point out an institutional and systematic difference between how different airlines approach this issue.
As in your situation some times an extension is not really a safety issue and is the right thing to do, other times, not so much.
DAL says they do not want to run the airline “lean,” let’s hope they are sincere and their actions match their memos.
Scoop
12-14-2019, 09:39 AM
#10
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Aug 2011
Position: Hoping for any position
Posts: 2,505
Originally Posted by rvfanatic
What are the contractual pay bumps that occur for extending at DAL? It seems your financial incentive to extend would explain the high numbers and it’s clear you’re implying that w the GS mention.
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