737 vs. 717 Ergonomics & Cockpit
05-26-2020 | 06:44 PM
#21
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Nov 2013
Posts: 2,605
Likes: 12
From: A320 Left seat
Out west we call the 73 the "Sarah Palin" just like "lipstick on a pig...."
often refer to the 717 as the "kick dog"
atleast we dont have the "rosie O donnell" the A380
I often thought the 777 was more like an "Anna Nicole Smith"
But my all time fav hands down!! the "Pam Anderson" the 75.... Skinny Body, nice tail, big engines..... will do anything for ya..
ooops I should not type during "Happy Hour"
often refer to the 717 as the "kick dog"
atleast we dont have the "rosie O donnell" the A380
I often thought the 777 was more like an "Anna Nicole Smith"
But my all time fav hands down!! the "Pam Anderson" the 75.... Skinny Body, nice tail, big engines..... will do anything for ya..
ooops I should not type during "Happy Hour"
05-27-2020 | 03:01 AM
#24
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 7,584
Likes: 293
From: DOWNGRADE COMPLETE: Thanks Gary. Thanks SWAPA.
I flew the 717 for three years and have been on the 737-700 & 800 for 14 years now (just shoot me). Hands down I prefer the 737.
For starters it’s got more of a “big airplane” feel in the switches, etc., whereas the 717 cockpit controls felt more like being in a CRJ (at least the overhead). The Guppy just feels “meatier” in the cockpit knobs, switches, dials, etc.
As for the seats....hands down the 737 is better, but it still sucks. Do not go fly the 717 without purchasing a quality seat cushion that you carry around on trips with you. Trust me. There were many AirTran 717 pilots with effed up backs because the seats are so bad.
Avionics-wise I definitely prefer the 737 FMS. It’s better laid out and more user friendly. A lot depends on what software your company has, too. For example, the VNAV on the Citrus birds behaved much better than on the SWA birds because the latter airline are complete cheapskates when it comes to what optional equipment they put in their cockpits (you should see what they actually ripped out of the cockpits during the conversion over). So VNAV performance depends a lot on the software, to state the obvious.
The wing on the 737 feels better than that POS Douglas wing did with its high loading. I hated how it felt like you were gonna fall out of the sky. The 737 (& 757) have that nice and cushy Boeing wing that inspires confidence.
That leads to the topic of landings. It’s hard to make a bad one, especially in a -700, but damn if the 717 isn’t capable of humbling you in this department. I had two doozies in the three years I spent on it (no masks dropped, but FIRM), and both from flaring without adding a generous amount of power, too.
Finally, the 717 is much, much quieter. DO NOT operate the Guppy without some good quality noise-canceling headsets. I did for the first seven years that I spent on it and have some hearing loss because of it. This is perhaps the 717’s biggest pro. It’s very quite.
Now can someone please start a thread about how the 737 compares to the A220? Boy, I’d like to fly that plane someday.
For starters it’s got more of a “big airplane” feel in the switches, etc., whereas the 717 cockpit controls felt more like being in a CRJ (at least the overhead). The Guppy just feels “meatier” in the cockpit knobs, switches, dials, etc.
As for the seats....hands down the 737 is better, but it still sucks. Do not go fly the 717 without purchasing a quality seat cushion that you carry around on trips with you. Trust me. There were many AirTran 717 pilots with effed up backs because the seats are so bad.
Avionics-wise I definitely prefer the 737 FMS. It’s better laid out and more user friendly. A lot depends on what software your company has, too. For example, the VNAV on the Citrus birds behaved much better than on the SWA birds because the latter airline are complete cheapskates when it comes to what optional equipment they put in their cockpits (you should see what they actually ripped out of the cockpits during the conversion over). So VNAV performance depends a lot on the software, to state the obvious.
The wing on the 737 feels better than that POS Douglas wing did with its high loading. I hated how it felt like you were gonna fall out of the sky. The 737 (& 757) have that nice and cushy Boeing wing that inspires confidence.
That leads to the topic of landings. It’s hard to make a bad one, especially in a -700, but damn if the 717 isn’t capable of humbling you in this department. I had two doozies in the three years I spent on it (no masks dropped, but FIRM), and both from flaring without adding a generous amount of power, too.
Finally, the 717 is much, much quieter. DO NOT operate the Guppy without some good quality noise-canceling headsets. I did for the first seven years that I spent on it and have some hearing loss because of it. This is perhaps the 717’s biggest pro. It’s very quite.
Now can someone please start a thread about how the 737 compares to the A220? Boy, I’d like to fly that plane someday.
05-27-2020 | 03:19 AM
#25
Line Holder
Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 1,160
Likes: 27
I flew the 717 for three years and have been on the 737-700 & 800 for 14 years now (just shoot me). Hands down I prefer the 737.
For starters it’s got more of a “big airplane” feel in the switches, etc., whereas the 717 cockpit controls felt more like being in a CRJ (at least the overhead). The Guppy just feels “meatier” in the cockpit knobs, switches, dials, etc.
As for the seats....hands down the 737 is better, but it still sucks. Do not go fly the 717 without purchasing a quality seat cushion that you carry around on trips with you. Trust me. There were many AirTran 717 pilots with effed up backs because the seats are so bad.
Avionics-wise I definitely prefer the 737 FMS. It’s better laid out and more user friendly. A lot depends on what software your company has, too. For example, the VNAV on the Citrus birds behaved much better than on the SWA birds because the latter airline are complete cheapskates when it comes to what optional equipment they put in their cockpits (you should see what they actually ripped out of the cockpits during the conversion over). So VNAV performance depends a lot on the software, to state the obvious.
The wing on the 737 feels better than that POS Douglas wing did with its high loading. I hated how it felt like you were gonna fall out of the sky. The 737 (& 757) have that nice and cushy Boeing wing that inspires confidence.
That leads to the topic of landings. It’s hard to make a bad one, especially in a -700, but damn if the 717 isn’t capable of humbling you in this department. I had two doozies in the three years I spent on it (no masks dropped, but FIRM), and both from flaring without adding a generous amount of power, too.
Finally, the 717 is much, much quieter. DO NOT operate the Guppy without some good quality noise-canceling headsets. I did for the first seven years that I spent on it and have some hearing loss because of it. This is perhaps the 717’s biggest pro. It’s very quite.
Now can someone please start a thread about how the 737 compares to the A220? Boy, I’d like to fly that plane someday.
For starters it’s got more of a “big airplane” feel in the switches, etc., whereas the 717 cockpit controls felt more like being in a CRJ (at least the overhead). The Guppy just feels “meatier” in the cockpit knobs, switches, dials, etc.
As for the seats....hands down the 737 is better, but it still sucks. Do not go fly the 717 without purchasing a quality seat cushion that you carry around on trips with you. Trust me. There were many AirTran 717 pilots with effed up backs because the seats are so bad.
Avionics-wise I definitely prefer the 737 FMS. It’s better laid out and more user friendly. A lot depends on what software your company has, too. For example, the VNAV on the Citrus birds behaved much better than on the SWA birds because the latter airline are complete cheapskates when it comes to what optional equipment they put in their cockpits (you should see what they actually ripped out of the cockpits during the conversion over). So VNAV performance depends a lot on the software, to state the obvious.
The wing on the 737 feels better than that POS Douglas wing did with its high loading. I hated how it felt like you were gonna fall out of the sky. The 737 (& 757) have that nice and cushy Boeing wing that inspires confidence.
That leads to the topic of landings. It’s hard to make a bad one, especially in a -700, but damn if the 717 isn’t capable of humbling you in this department. I had two doozies in the three years I spent on it (no masks dropped, but FIRM), and both from flaring without adding a generous amount of power, too.
Finally, the 717 is much, much quieter. DO NOT operate the Guppy without some good quality noise-canceling headsets. I did for the first seven years that I spent on it and have some hearing loss because of it. This is perhaps the 717’s biggest pro. It’s very quite.
Now can someone please start a thread about how the 737 compares to the A220? Boy, I’d like to fly that plane someday.
I was hoping they might have brought it to ATL
05-27-2020 | 04:44 AM
#26
Can't abide NAI
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 12,078
Likes: 15
From: Douglas Aerospace post production Flight Test & Work Around Engineering bulletin dissembler
Fly by wire - much more natural feeling and more responsive than the A320
Cockpit - never flew the 717, but the 737 flight deck was terrible IMO. Ergonomics were not a concern in 1962 - THEN they figured out how to shove your bulkhead another few inches towards the panel to move the galley and make more room in the cabin. The C Series is Airbus comfy and even quieter.
My C Series experience is too limited to say much about how it is to fly. Maybe some others can chime in.
Friends have told me it is a bit underpowered and quirky as hell to get it's systems all working.
The 737 is amazingly reliable. Of course it may be that the CAS (six pack) is just such crap that when it does break the pilot isn't even aware.
05-27-2020 | 07:48 AM
#27
Line Holder
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 423
Likes: 3
From: 717 FO
There's less room between you and the sidewall on the 737 but it feels like a bigger cockpit to me overall versus the 717. There's more distance between you and the boarding area, whereas on the 717, people are getting on/off right behind you. The seats, trips, and landings are better on the 737, but I prefer the avionics and mode control panel of the 717. Lastly, it's so nice to use a hot mic again. For me, that really solidifies the 737 as the better option.
05-27-2020 | 08:19 AM
#28
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Sep 2013
Posts: 6,605
Likes: 363
From: Sitting SC at the Five Towns
Yeah I forgot about the concrete landing gear struts on the 717.
Another fine example of Douglas engineering: when you deploy the speedbrakes the aircraft rolls. The sliderule they used that day was probably bent.
Another fine example of Douglas engineering: when you deploy the speedbrakes the aircraft rolls. The sliderule they used that day was probably bent.
05-27-2020 | 08:25 AM
#29
Cloudbase
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 566
Likes: 28
From: 717A
Why do people think the 717 is so hard to land well? The dang thing gives you a 5 ft callout. Turn the autothrust off first of all so you aren't left guessing your energy state. Then stop yoke pumping and you won't drive your mains into the ground every 3rd time. Didn't your mama teach you how to flare?
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