I’m not angry at all. I’m having a discussion. Why can’t someone have a differing opinion than you? After all, I’m not the one starting threads to scold others and call them greedy for not having compassion for your misfortune.

but yes, it is absolutely about the money. If it goes to you, it’s good. If it doesn’t, it’s greed (your words).

You do know that goes both ways, right? "money grab by the senior guys"

You have nothing to worry about Chief. You have the numbers much like the democrats and can ram anything you want down anyone's throat that doesn't have a voice. Again, I wanted data points regarding the near furlough and those involved.

And I thank you.

I’m not in the near furlough group, so you can take me out of your spreadsheet.

but why make this about partisan politics?

An-al-o-gy. And this issue is VERY partisan in case you haven't noticed.

That would be a huge concession to the company. The scale topping out at 12 is a massive win for the pilot group as it gets more money to pilots sooner. LBP won't resemble some magical moral mandate where we just add another 30 years of annual raises on top with no downside. It would be us trying to spread the pay we could negotiate much thinner. Using a blended rate similar to the existing ER rate would put that top scale at around $600/hr. Unless all those longevity bumps were fractions of one percent, but then what's the point of that?

I'm more concerned with getting rid of "training pay" in favor of full line pay (plus hotels and uniforms) like UAL does rather than the antiquated "pay your dues" model. We all want more money and we should negotiate as best we can. But whatever we get shouldn't be spread over nearly half a century of pay tables. Getting 42+ years on the list is legendary ninja territory. Good for them. It shouldn't take them that long to get the top pay rate. As it is now they get to spend 30 years at the top rate. That's pretty good.

Closest alligator to the boat WRT LBP style concerns anyway is to blend a category or two. Of all the things in section 6 plus the new MBP I just don't see any mandate whatsoever for trying to fully and completely reinvent the wheel with this. But feel free to publish that pay rate spreadsheet so we can see how it would play out and maybe it'll change some minds.

for what it’s worth, I’d be happy to entertain restoration. What I don’t need is condescending accusations of greed and lack of compassion when you encounter anything that seems like disagreement.

I’d love to have a real discussion about needs and how much our pilots actually have for retirement. What I don’t need is a concern troll acting like he’s “just asking questions,” in a transparent attempt to hide his opinion.

i’d love to discuss retiree medical and other situations that make retirement a real problem for our pilots. What I don’t need is someone reflexively dismissing any differing opinions with partisan political BS and insults.


so, there’s one data point for your totally neutral and not-at-all-advocating-for-one-position-over-another poll from someone in the not nearly furloughed group.

I can't necessarily argue all of your points except that the 12 year scale absolutely depends on getting a contract within the prescribed time. When was the last pay increase you got? I would be amenable to that tack if we could get a COLA built into the contract when in negotiations. Tie it to inflation or something, but I have 4 years left and I highly doubt I will see another pay increase before I leave. It's just not right.

I agree that is something we should try and get in any case. A century old rail road law lets airlines negotifake for years whenever they want to. At the very least we should tack on a C.P.Lie raise.

I am not interested in 'restoration' in terms of a DB. I like the idea of the MBCBP, except that it won't happen within any meaningful time frame. Like I said in the other post, I do not expect to see a pay increase before I leave in 4 years, so the MBCBP does me zero. I can live with that.

One thing you mention is a great idea. retiree medical for a few years out of Delta. DAL pays for it so it is no skin of junior's nose.

Try some decaf this late in the day... and stop throwing rocks in your glass house. I have read enough of your insulting diatribes in other threads

Scope.

Work rules. Especially reserve rules.

Retro...what are the odds since COVID?