Bucking Bar

This is their plan. The proposal is $50,000.00 for 5 years, per retiree in exchange for whatever they could find to sell.

The Reps who want this think getting C44 out of the way will make this happen. Hence the recall. .....

(it won't work)

Frankly, $250,000.00 isn't really enough to move the needle on these folks who already have ~$3m+, but it is enough for management to refuse (not that much money in 35 Rjs). If it miraculously get through the MEC & management, the Delta pilots would likely kill it at memrat. Too little too far away for the middle and junior pilots.

C44 Rep posted that he'd suggest a larger DC into a MBCBP to reach a similar effect, but the self-defined DZ strongly prefer lump sum cash and / or defined benefit plans.

TED74

I appreciate the writeup - makes sense to me.

I have to be honest, though, I want more vacation and I am willing to trade for it. I will trade a week of work for a week of vacation paid at 5:15/day.

sailingfun

The union needs to look and consider all options. Just say no is about as a effective strategy as a banzai charge against machine guns. It’s brave, it’s chest thumping but also very ineffective. First they need to go back and review all the negotiation notes pertaining to the scope section. This should of course already have been accomplished. Then they need to run this by the best legal help they can get and try and arrive at a decision on our chances with a grievance. If after review they say we are a lock to win or at least 75% than no is the correct and only answer to the company.
If on the other hand they say it’s a 50/50 crapshoot that the company can get those 35 airframes back the choices become more difficult. They become become extremity difficult if they say we will probably lose. There is negotiations leverage even if it’s felt we will not win. It could be used for other improvements or to drive a complete rewrite of section 1 outside of section 6 negotiations. A loss in arbitration produces zero gains and the company gets the airframes.
I expect the company will conclude a flow with Endeavour and put those airplanes back in service immediately. At that point we will file a grievance. Once the grievance is on file there will be negotiations prior to a ruling. We need to be smart on how we handle that based on what I said in the first paragraph.
My initial reading of that section in the contract had me feeling it’s a easy company win. As I read it a few more times and look at the companies timing I feel we might have a decent chance. The company did not need the airframes when the agreement was pulled down. They acknowledged in numerous communications they did not have access to the airframes. They made no attempt to conclude a flow agreement at the time. Now with the training bottleneck they can’t put the remaining 717’s back in service per networks request. The E175’s become de facto 717 replacements. I think that weighs heavily on our side. What I don’t have is any idea of the context the negotiators notes might add. Being stupid often feels good, being smart produces results.

paragraph in dispute: Exception two: In the event the hiring or flow provisions of NWA LOA 2006-10 or LOA #9 cease to be available, either at the feeder carrier affiliate referenced in such LOAs or at another carrier, the number of permitted 76-seat aircraft in Section 1 B. 5 47. e. will be reduced by 35.

What I don’t like is why this paragraph was added as on the surface there is no need as they retained the LOA’s involved.

Bucking Bar

That is the most terrifying WARNING I have ever seen in my 15,000+ hour aviation career.

I'll need four pairs of shoes, maps to the Board Members' houses and a barrel to burn wood in to keep warm with my buddies all winter in between picketing sessions if that is where we are going.

Compass was a direct outsource of NWA's DC9 flying. They were part of the NWA MEC (and Delta MEC). Those jets have different limits. They are not simply replaceable with the outsourced flavor of the day.

sailingfun

What you are missing is we are in section one negotiations. It’s going to change as many parts of it simply have no relevance in the post covid airline structure. If we can negotiate a new agreement that favors the pilot group I am all for it. We may have some leverage to drive positive changes for Delta pilots with this RJ mess.

Gone Flying

fair enough, I’m sure it was just some people blowing off steam, but that was the only place I’ve heard it discussed. As far as some of them getting screwed, I agree, especially those that spent years on the street. It is just frustrating because it’s not DL pilots who screwed them, but it is all pilots who would suffer from a scope sale. I hope we can find a way to increase DC for those hired pre 9/11.

Funk

FIFY. Don't feed the animals that want a special carve out for themselves because of real or perceived grievances that date back multiple contract cycles before the present. Improvements should be improvements for all. Attempting to satiate some vocal group is likely a fool's errand because many will not be happy with any result, no matter how favorable to themselves.

Bucking Bar

We have leverage as a result of the company being out of compliance in almost every measure of our labor protective provisions. They want to solve that problem. We also need to solve that problem.

Earlier, the company had no interest in a global capacity measure.

Much would depend on how the company manages JV flying going forward. If global revenue and network management are consolidated in Atlanta and the company has control, that change would explain Management's renewed interest in a previously rejected proposal.

The only global capacity agreement I could see the pilots having much interest in would be a clear win. Something like a capacity measure including the "and beyonds" from places like Paris to Stockholm or Bucharest. This would recapture a capacity share for the flying that we lost doing point-to-point from the US to these secondary global cities. It is probably the only thing that makes sense with the Korean JV. For that very reason it is hard to imagine management has any interest at a percentage share which would actually benefit the Delta pilots.

The problem is that we can't even get Delta to comply with our scope how much less so Korean?

I do have confidence in our team, they will seek a deal that is advantageous to Delta pilots. However if some part of this team gets recalled, then we will need a scope expert to serve as interim rep and possibly beyond.

DWC CAP10 USAF

Who exactly is “their”?

Bucking Bar

Mods got on to me for citing names, even of political figures. So, as the rules are applied....