And yet we had a clueless Moakist ATL FO rep telling us we better vote this in, cuz he’s seen the inside numbers (looking forward) and it wasn’t good. Another smartest guy in the room—like the rest of the black polo shirt ****s.

 

APC isn’t a source.

Show me something from DALPA or the company.

 

Part of the problem with TA1 was it was a sub-par rush job that embraced the “then” MEC narrative that you had to take concessions for pay (aka “unlocking value”).

Compounding that was the sell job. The then MEC (a majority, anyway) treated a very marginal agreement like it was the second coming. It only intensified as the pushback got stronger. After the 117 LOA, pilots’ radar was up and most were paying attention, and when the PR campaign intensified, people starting smelling the BS from the nature of the sell job alone.

The combination of the rushed agreement, toxic individual issues, and the over-the-top sell job was surprisingly amateur hour for an MEC that was, in theory, guided by some of the “smartest men in the room” and shows what happens to people when they fall prey to believing their own press.

 

It was "top men".

 

Historically, TA1 was the first and only time Delta pilots have rejected a TA. I don’t really (much) care what has happened at other carriers. They are not negotiating against Delta management.

Of all the things that can be gleaned as best practices from other carrier’s negotiations, that ain’t one, IMO.

 

I’m not convinced that the extra year extension hurt us on TA2. The company and union were not in any mindset of finding common ground on a theoretical contract in 2018/19. Remember the toxicity back then? That’s a pay raise we wouldn’t have if the contract became amendable in 2018.

I do agree that hitting quick “doubles” is a smarter way than holding out for “grand slams”. The wait for successive grandslams may yield total value less than quick multiple “doubles.”

I could have lived with TA1, but there were some extremely toxic issues: profit sharing cut, 23G5 FO trip buys for OE cuts, wimpy pay tables to name a few.

TA2 was a sure win. That worked out. As far as any “TA2s” being worse? It’s not exactly the same, but ask the AirTran pilots how they like their second seniority list with SW vs their first offer.

 

Apples and hammers comparison.

That was two non ALPA unions negotiating while the acquiring airline had good relations with and backed the in house union. The attempt was noble, the result was incendiary. All three entities learned from that and Herb's SWA died.

 

Everything you wrote was spot on. However, I don't get the "after the 117 LOA, pilots' radar was up" comment. Despite MD being the MEC Chair when TA1 was being pushed, then rejected (and he then resigned), he was also the chair when we inked the 117 LOA, as far as I am concerned, the single greatest agreement we have ever reached with the company (perhaps LOA 20-04 is better) in terms of favorable impacts to our careers. 5.15 ADG, which also applied to reserves was the best thing...ever. Reserve work rules prior to that were so absymal that anyone bidding reserve on purpose should have been sent for evaluation.

So many thousands of Delta pilots have had their work lives significantly improved since then, and presumably in perpetuity. Few even realize it, and due to the sub-par TA1, and very unwise chanting of "PEB!" when pressed about it, MD gets a lot of grief. It is/was in fact warranted, but he also deserves credit where it is due.

 

Per the 117 LOA:

Wasn't there an agreement for split duty periods (CDOs, high speeds, stand ups, lean overs, whatever you want to call them) to be built in the bid package and awarded via PBS? They would pay less than 10:30.

Then social media found out and blew up which caused that part of the LOA to be removed.

 

The problem was that part of the agreement was added at our request! Much like 5 day domestic trips be careful what your fellow pilots are asking for! Also be aware that nothing in the current contract prevents the company from flying stand ups. The change would have reduced credit time in their construction by eliminating the 5:15 per day that you mention. Some pilots wanted this to encourage the company to build such trips.
You have a union for two reasons, to try and protect yourself from the company and to protect yourself from your fellow pilots!