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-   -   Pilot morale (https://www.airlinepilotforums.com/delta/137017-pilot-morale.html)

Crown 03-19-2022 05:52 AM


Originally Posted by smellson (Post 3391240)
​​​​​​Everytime I've called in fatigued the duty pilot has 110% had my back. Never caught any flack from anyone afterwards either. As someone who was at one point a little paranoid at work, I simply don't feel any "threat" from my cpo. Nobody should be afraid to call in fatigued/sick...

I'm envious. That was not my experience last summer. Both times, the Duty Pilot just told me that I was legal for it. No support. None.

hvydvr 03-19-2022 06:19 AM


Originally Posted by Crown (Post 3391232)
why would they go up when the Duty Pilot doesn't have your back?

Numerous convos with pilots + my own experience shows that calling in fatigued is still frowned upon, and while maybe not be punitive, "on the radar" is a very real thing

My experience with this (twice in the last 12 months) was 180 out. Total support from duty pilot and system worked well. As far as “being on the radar”, I don’t care if my name is in bright lights with a red carpet leading to the CPO, I’ll call in fatigued when appropriate.

FangsF15 03-19-2022 06:42 AM


Originally Posted by Crown (Post 3391244)
I'm envious. That was not my experience last summer. Both times, the Duty Pilot just told me that I was legal for it. No support. None.

I think I would chalk that up to a bad experience/Duty Pilot, Crown. The recent DALPA MEC podcast has gone out our their way to say the experience is zero threat, and there is zero tracking (there isn't really a mechanism, according to APLA).

If you are fatigued, please call it.

CBreezy 03-19-2022 06:50 AM


Originally Posted by FangsF15 (Post 3391274)
I think I would chalk that up to a bad experience/Duty Pilot, Crown. The recent DALPA MEC podcast has gone out our their way to say the experience is zero threat, and there is zero tracking (there isn't really a mechanism, according to APLA).

If you are fatigued, please call it.

This. Fatigue reports are de-identified.

CBreezy 03-19-2022 06:53 AM


Originally Posted by Crown (Post 3391244)
I'm envious. That was not my experience last summer. Both times, the Duty Pilot just told me that I was legal for it. No support. None.

You said, "I'm fatigued." And his response was, "it's legal?" I've called in a few times during a legal rotation and I've never gotten any flack or pushback.

Jp8burner 03-19-2022 07:05 AM

I’ve called in several times (2 over the last 3 months most recently), never had pushback.

Quite frankly the last time I called in I didn’t need an extension, it was just a long day with crappy sleep and the hour delay in the second flight was just too much for me. What can I say, I’m a wuss.

Don’t call the DP looking for justification, you have nothing to prove to them and they are not the judge. Their only job is to acknowledge and process your UNfit/Fatigue status. If a DP gives you pushback I’d say “I understand you don’t agree, I am still calling in fatigued.” I would certainly note the DP pushback in the report to ensure the FAA gets eyes on it.

DWC CAP10 USAF 03-19-2022 08:07 AM


Originally Posted by Whoopsmybad (Post 3390748)
I know there will be exceptions, but the group voted overwhelmingly for the LOA.

LOA 20-03 passed by 93 votes....not my definition of overwhelmingly

Hrkdrivr 03-19-2022 08:46 AM


Originally Posted by Jp8burner;[url=tel:3391288
3391288]I’ve called in several times (2 over the last 3 months most recently), never had pushback.

Quite frankly the last time I called in I didn’t need an extension, it was just a long day with crappy sleep and the hour delay in the second flight was just too much for me. What can I say, I’m a wuss.

Don’t call the DP looking for justification, you have nothing to prove to them and they are not the judge. Their only job is to acknowledge and process your UNfit/Fatigue status. If a DP gives you pushback I’d say “I understand you don’t agree, I am still calling in fatigued.” I would certainly note the DP pushback in the report to ensure the FAA gets eyes on it.

This. They are facilitating downstream changes that will happen so you can get the rest you need. Don’t ask them anything, tell them. Tell them you’re done and when you’ll be rested again to be safe to fly.

That said, I’ve had nothing but excellent support from the Duty Pilots when I’ve had to call fatigued or not extending.

Guppydriver95 03-19-2022 09:22 AM


Originally Posted by Hrkdrivr (Post 3391349)
This. They are facilitating downstream changes that will happen so you can get the rest you need. Don’t ask them anything, tell them. Tell them you’re done and when you’ll be rested again to be safe to fly.

That said, I’ve had nothing but excellent support from the Duty Pilots when I’ve had to call fatigued or not extending.

In my humble opinion, this is the biggest difference between my employer (U) and Delta, wrt fatigue calls. There shouldn’t have to be a “conversation” with anybody in order not to extend. Acars message comes across and says pretty please, you type back “unable to extend” and it’s done. All the pairing modifications happen automatically without speaking to a soul. If Delta keeps the current process in place, there will always be a certain percentage of pilots who feel like they’re being sent to the principal’s office and will extend just to avoid it. Yes it’s wrong headed and weak, but we all know it’s true. Remove the required conversation with a human from the “unable to extend” process.

bsh932 03-19-2022 09:34 AM


Originally Posted by Crown (Post 3391244)
I'm envious. That was not my experience last summer. Both times, the Duty Pilot just told me that I was legal for it. No support. None.

I called in fatigued last year before I even checked in for my trip because I didn't sleep well due to sick kids. Absolutely no push back. The duty pilot just told me to fill out the report and the company would determine if I would be paid out of my sick bank. He was very understanding and gave me no problems. Fatigued is fatigued no matter what the cause. You or 100% pay protected even if it has to come out of your sick bank. Never feel like you have to fly fatigued.


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