Agreed, no 767-300 block hours equivalent to the AF A380. But what about partners flying 321XLRs to the the US? That can kill WB growth just as easily as the no limit CRJs once killed NB growth... just tomorrow in Trans-atlantic/Latin America.

Excluded from which side?

What if AF/KLM/etc start flying 75's or 321XLR's (or whatever) across the pond? That's also another potential "loophole" and you can bet the company knows dang well if they'll do it or not.

Feel however you want. I’m not telling you what to do. But you’re trying to paint my skepticism in a dishonest, absolutist way. 2 communiques so far (initial announcement and today’s) and nothing but positive spin. That doesn’t mean I’ve made up my mind, as you appear to have done, but I see it as a warning sign to be more critical and wary when the real language does come out. For some reason you feel the need to berate me for questioning something from DALPA. I’ll be happy to see a balanced critique from them when it all gets released, but I’m prepared not to. You don’t have to attack anyone who disagrees with you on anything with over the top rhetoric.

What part of "wait until the language comes out before making a decision" reads like I've made up my mind?

If "he does not tolerate fools or liars", I hope he doesn't look in the mirror much.

He's a duplicitous, arrogant POS who interviewed for a mgmt job while in a high-level union position.

The only Delta pilot he "advocates" for is himself.

The Moak-like brainwashed drivel in your first sentence reminded me of The Manchurian Candidate. Keep up the good work, bud

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pZWgnt50g4k

Maybe I can be some help. The agreement in principal is between the pilots and company. Theres a framework, theres an intent, there's notes which both sides understand and have seen and can go back to. There ARE lawyers in the room, but the lawyers didnt really come to an agreement.

The next couple weeks, the lawyers are going to dither and whine over the shall going before the and, or after. Theyll spend 8 hours a day, for weeks deciding if the sentence should include references to the previous section, or simply reaffirm there in the paragraph below how both sections are being referred to.

You ever buy a house? Did you have to wait for the title company to copy paste their contract with different names and addresses for 30-45 days? We're done. Im gonna go pick out furniture and tell the guy i dont need the storage place in 60 days. Im gonna look at bigger grills and find that guy that did the blinds last time for the new house. Of course, something could go wrong but 99% of the time this is worked out.

Theyre gonna tell us what we are buying, they are going to give us whatever is done for language, then WE are going to vote yes or no. Its not a con job, obviously some weirdos are more salesy than others. I hate sales people too. Talk to ur reps, give these guys some time, we are gonna get there.

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It was more of you attacking me out of nowhere because I suggested we shouldn’t blindly trust DALPA. I’m not anti-DALPA, but as I mentioned in previous posts I believe there are inherent and unavoidable pressures that can influence their sense of needing to sell a TA that they send for memrat. As a result I think we should be extra critical when they come out of the gate with all positive spin. Past experience warrants it I think.

But it sounds like we at least agree that everyone should read the language carefully when it comes out.

I appreciate what you’re saying, but this isn’t my first TA. All I’m saying is that my impression of the initial messages reminds me of previous hard sells from DALPA, and that we should all read it carefully and not just accept whatever explainers they give us. I’m not naive, and I don’t believe DALPA are bad actors or trying to con us. But there are real pressures on them that can influence how they present it to us. In short, we should all read the full language carefully before making a decision.

You ought to listen to the podcast and judge for yourself. My interpretation of what I heard was that any block hour by a JV has to be offset 1:1 by DAL widebody flying. That’s what Ambrosi said. I will wait on the final language to see if it fulfills that promise. If so, it would be a win because AF/KLM or VA could fly 321XLRs all they want and we have to get WB hours 1:1. Again, pending final language, that sounds pretty good. My beef is that 1:1 growth is a loss when we own 49% of a JV - they are not an equal partner and we shouldn’t pretend that they should get half of the flying.

Exactly.....................