I think it’ll about the same, but Delta pilots will be getting bigger profit sharing checks.

And with respect to your second hypothetical (10% raise DOS), you didn’t have to worry about that did you? Because APA BOD killed a TA with that exact year one raise last fall. You’re welcome.

huh, I thought it did if we were also flying NBs across the Atlantic. I saw the first exception (does not trigger OC pay) but missed the second (will not receive OC pay) Learned something new.

yeah, totally me deliberately putting out false info and not just making a mistake…

Ok, what if it was 15%? What if it was 25%?

What if, what if. Let me ask you this. What if APA accepted that 10% raise year one last fall, instead of holding the line so publicly? What do you think your TA would be?

It's Batman and Riddler play putt-putt golf as if you didn't know:)

I might be lacking in communication skills as you are inclined to believe. I am having trouble with, " I already told you. APA’s position in the past has been that PS isn’t counted towards a contract’s value since profits can’t be assured.". So not only am I a poor communicator but now I must also be stoopid because this is the most ridiculous argument imaginable to me(although it is ALPA's table position). If it has no cost why didn't you get Delta's PS years ago? The answer is .....because there is a cost associated.

So, let's start over. 1. Do you think management put a cost to getting Delta's PS formula for AA? 2. Do you think APA assigned a cost to getting the PS?. If the answer to either question 1 or 2 is yes, could you attempt to quantify what YOU think would be a reasonable cost for that ?


An additional fact for you consideration. I know senior pilots who got a 1 year PS payout including the DC of 16% that was in excess of $90,000. so, bonus question, Am I supposed to believe that there is no cost associated with PS because it is not guaranteed?

There is no way I could answer that accurately and neither could you. You’re asking me to guess or go with my gut instinct. I prefer to stick to tangible facts. The facts that I have is that AA isn’t nearly as profitable as Delta, therefore if there was indeed a value tied to PS, it would be significantly of less worth than to a Delta pilot. The only official position I’ve seen taken on this very issue is APA’s stance that PS is not included in contract value.

If it’s still not sinking in for you, then I don’t know how to help you.

The eff I can't. There is a cost associated.

edit. If the average Delta pilot makes 200K year and over the last 10 years the average PS payout has been 8%....that comes to 240M dollars a year on average for PS. Over a 4 year contract that comes to 1 B dollars. So, am I to believe that there is no cost associated because AA doesn't make as much and/or APA says there is not a cost? I am fairly confident management put a price tag on it.

Well if you can, then DO! What is the dollar value DALPA and/or Delta assigned to PS in your $7B contract? Then try to wrap your head around the fact that whatever number you may or may not come up with, it’s significantly smaller (if anything at all) at AA for reasons already mentioned. Try sticking to tangible facts instead of another ad hominem and a stupid analogy about ice cream.

my dad’s contract can beat up your dad’s contract

It’s the Mickey Mouse club version of CC