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Old 10-26-2025 | 06:15 AM
  #651  
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Originally Posted by Johnnychimpo
Go check the other major’s amendable dates…they’ve just blatantly set themselves up to have us do all the heavy lifting again.
I’m aware. I just think DL is looking to stick it to us in negotiations and it’s very possible UA reaches a deal before us. They have been attacking every facet of our CBA since it was ratified. That’s not an accident. it’s behavior that since the NMB has show they will allow, I expect them to allow to continue unchecked.
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Old 10-26-2025 | 06:16 AM
  #652  
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Originally Posted by FangsF15
C15 TA2 was concessionary? Was C12?

C19 was worth the wait, and don't pretend that Covid wasn't the vast majority for why that was 'late'. Had Covid not happened, that would have been done within a year of amendable date.
C12 was absolutely concessionary. How much have we collectively given up in PS since then??? How long was the timeline from C15 openers to TA2 signing???
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Old 10-26-2025 | 06:21 AM
  #653  
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Originally Posted by FangsF15
You think it will take at least 2 years, "likely" 3+ to get a contract?

I guess I'm insane then.
there are several examples of CBAs taking years (Covid aside) because it’s cheaper for the company and the NMB does not push them to actually negotiate. If DL decides they don’t want to play ball they could 100% use the process to take years to get an agreement.

Remember AA and UA had agreements had been amendable for over a year when Covid hit. Even excluding Covid pause, both carriers were in negotiations for 2-3 years before they got their contracts in 2023. When AA declared bankruptcy their contract had been amendable for 4-5 years and was signed over 8 years before their BK.
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Old 10-26-2025 | 06:24 AM
  #654  
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Originally Posted by Softheborder
C12 was absolutely concessionary. How much have we collectively given up in PS since then??? How long was the timeline from C15 openers to TA2 signing???
you said within a year of the amendable date. C2015 was signed within a year of the amendable date, regardless of when negotiations started.

the TA1 fallout was also responsible for a good chunk of the time it took.
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Old 10-26-2025 | 06:31 AM
  #655  
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Originally Posted by Gone Flying
there are several examples of CBAs taking years (Covid aside) because it’s cheaper for the company and the NMB does not push them to actually negotiate. If DL decides they don’t want to play ball they could 100% use the process to take years to get an agreement.

Remember AA and UA had agreements had been amendable for over a year when Covid hit. Even excluding Covid pause, both carriers were in negotiations for 2-3 years before they got their contracts in 2023. When AA declared bankruptcy their contract had been amendable for 4-5 years and was signed almost a decade before their BK.
It is always to the company's advantage to drag out negotiations. They lock in the existing rates. We never get FULL retro. They stall until a crisis is available to exploit. When was the last time an airline was making good profits with a good outlook and signed a timely deal that was not concessionary or appeasing? They will crank up the doom and gloom machine, make life more difficult in general to pressure the NC and MEC, and sow the seeds of conflict within the group... kinda like the latest IA tactic.
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Old 10-26-2025 | 06:54 AM
  #656  
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Originally Posted by notEnuf
It is always to the company's advantage to drag out negotiations. They lock in the existing rates. We never get FULL retro. They stall until a crisis is available to exploit. When was the last time an airline was making good profits with a good outlook and signed a timely deal that was not concessionary or appeasing? They will crank up the doom and gloom machine, make life more difficult in general to pressure the NC and MEC, and sow the seeds of conflict within the group... kinda like the latest IA tactic.
Agreed. And while we get some/all retro, the QOL benefits we miss out on until signing. And soft pay like EDP/SIT/CARVE improvements are never reflected in retro.

I'm not expecting any quick deal.
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Old 10-26-2025 | 07:12 AM
  #657  
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Originally Posted by iaflyer
Agreed. And while we get some/all retro, the QOL benefits we miss out on until signing. And soft pay like EDP/SIT/CARVE improvements are never reflected in retro.

I'm not expecting any quick deal.
Hats should come off the first day after the amenable date…

Edit: for those that actually put them back on after the last contract was signed…
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Old 10-26-2025 | 07:56 AM
  #658  
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Originally Posted by tennisguru
Hats should come off the first day after the amenable date…

Edit: for those that actually put them back on after the last contract was signed…
nah- if we get lanyards with a clever slogan on them that will really make a point
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Old 10-26-2025 | 08:07 AM
  #659  
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Originally Posted by FyrePilot
nah- if we get lanyards with a clever slogan on them that will really make a point
Let's pick the loudest ugliest color possible.

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Old 10-26-2025 | 08:44 AM
  #660  
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Originally Posted by notEnuf
Let's pick the loudest ugliest color possible.
Propeller beanies in those colors. But a foldable prop like a helicopter to make it commuter friendly.
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