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-   -   MOU 25-05 (https://www.airlinepilotforums.com/delta/151540-mou-25-05-a.html)

CBreezy 12-24-2025 05:15 AM


Originally Posted by ancman (Post 3984901)
For every pilot whose name is listed repeatedly in the 23M7 logs, there are 100 other pilots trying to be him/her with the same slip configuration.

The names that you see repeatedly are the ones who happen to be the most senior of that large group, AND in the right place at the right time. They literally have no control over how many times they appear relative to everyone else.

Direct your hate at the game, not the player.

The game is broken. It needs fixed. The company very likely wants it fixed. The union should horse trade.

ancman 12-24-2025 05:19 AM


Originally Posted by CBreezy (Post 3984906)
The game is broken. It needs fixed. The company very likely wants it fixed. The union should horse trade.

We’ll see if the deal reached in section 6 is acceptable or not.

No more LOA/MOU Band-Aids between now and then.

CBreezy 12-24-2025 05:24 AM


Originally Posted by ancman (Post 3984907)
We’ll see if the deal reached in section 6 is acceptable or not.

No more LOA/MOU Band-Aids between now and then.

You'll never know what bartering was made in section 6. I'm not saying we should immediately exchange but this is a bad argument that is setting up the entire scenario for failure

ancman 12-24-2025 05:28 AM


Originally Posted by CBreezy (Post 3984909)
You'll never know what bartering was made in section 6. I'm not saying we should immediately exchange but this is a bad argument that is setting up the entire scenario for failure

Most pilots are wise enough to evaluate the deal in its entirety.

Giving away our greatest piece of leverage before section 6 would be the worst strategic blunder we could possibly make.

As the costs of management’s blunder continue to grow by the day, so does our section 6 leverage. Management wants it fixed now. We shouldn’t even entertain that without a new comprehensive contract that blows the rest of the industry out of the water.

Gunfighter 12-24-2025 05:44 AM


Originally Posted by CBreezy (Post 3984909)
You'll never know what bartering was made in section 6. I'm not saying we should immediately exchange but this is a bad argument that is setting up the entire scenario for failure

It's not about the exact quid, it's about the pressure to get a full contract completed in a timely manner.
Will we have a contract sooner if the company needs it to solve trip coverage?
If there isn't trip coverage pressure, can the company drag their feet in negotiations?

Whoopsmybad 12-24-2025 05:48 AM


Originally Posted by ancman (Post 3984910)
Most pilots are wise enough to evaluate the deal in its entirety.

Giving away our greatest piece of leverage before section 6 would be the worst strategic blunder we could possibly make.

As the costs of management’s blunder continue to grow by the day, so does our section 6 leverage. Management wants it fixed now. We shouldn’t even entertain that without a new comprehensive contract that blows the rest of the industry out of the water.

Look, with pilots tripping over themselves and playing wait on hold games in the hopes of getting an IA, I don’t think we have remotely close to the leverage you think we have. The planes are flying, someone is getting paid.
NEWS FLASH: CS does now GAF who is getting paid what as long as the metal is moving.

The company would love to get the coverage ladder retooled to be more efficient, but there’s a ton of pilots who are completely missing out and getting screwed that want it more.

Gunfighter 12-24-2025 05:52 AM


Originally Posted by Whoopsmybad (Post 3984917)
Look, with pilots tripping over themselves and playing wait on hold games in the hopes of getting an IA, I don’t think we have remotely close to the leverage you think we have. The planes are flying, someone is getting paid.
NEWS FLASH: CS does now GAF who is getting paid what as long as the metal is moving.

The company would love to get the coverage ladder retooled to be more efficient, but there’s a ton of pilots who are completely missing out and getting screwed that want it more.

NEWS FLASH: We aren't negotiating with CS. We are negotiating with executives who care about triple pay.

CBreezy 12-24-2025 05:57 AM


Originally Posted by Gunfighter (Post 3984915)
It's not about the exact quid, it's about the pressure to get a full contract completed in a timely manner.
Will we have a contract sooner if the company needs it to solve trip coverage?
If there isn't trip coverage pressure, can the company drag their feet in negotiations?

Like I said, I am not arguing we should do it now. I'm just calling it now. IF they eliminate or fundamentally change the things that cause 23m7 and there isn't a clear and large quid, especially if you say this will force them to make a deal faster, there will be near riots on SM saying the agreement is full concessions and ALPA caved to get a deal done early.


ancman 12-24-2025 06:10 AM


Originally Posted by Whoopsmybad (Post 3984917)
Look, with pilots tripping over themselves and playing wait on hold games in the hopes of getting an IA, I don’t think we have remotely close to the leverage you think we have. The planes are flying, someone is getting paid.
NEWS FLASH: CS does now GAF who is getting paid what as long as the metal is moving.

The company would love to get the coverage ladder retooled to be more efficient, but there’s a ton of pilots who are completely missing out and getting screwed that want it more.

Then put pressure on management to implement the agreement they already agreed to (25-05). If they fail to, then it’s proof that they’re negotiating in bad faith.

The leverage present is massive. Of course the underpaid, overworked crew scheduler doesn’t care. Executive management 100% does.

hockeypilot44 12-24-2025 06:13 AM


Originally Posted by ancman (Post 3984907)
We’ll see if the deal reached in section 6 is acceptable or not.

No more LOA/MOU Band-Aids between now and then.

I’m opposite. I’m willing to give up auto accept and have unlimited batch sizes if they change 23.M.7 to pay protecting every single pilot with a slip in when used or remove it from contract outright. I’m not willing to wait years for a fix. The financial loss is too great. About $8,000 per month for me amd that doesn’t include the profit sharing loss. It’s probably closer to $10,000 per month. So yeah, I’m not going quietly. I’ve also written my reps and been into chief pilots’ office about this.


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