Openers today?
04-16-2026 | 09:10 PM
#311
Roll’n Thunder
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 5,109
Likes: 520
From: Pilot
The are two types of PB day usage. PB washing, while technically can be done solo with all blue days, generally almost always requires a partner which means that reserve coverage is irrelevant. What is affected by pre-posted rest is when a pilot actually wants to just drop a trip or reserve day with pay. That can only be done with positive coverage which of course is killed by PPR.
04-17-2026 | 01:29 AM
#312
Moderator
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 7,413
Likes: 413
The are two types of PB day usage. PB washing, while technically can be done solo with all blue days, generally almost always requires a partner which means that reserve coverage is irrelevant. What is affected by pre-posted rest is when a pilot actually wants to just drop a trip or reserve day with pay. That can only be done with positive coverage which of course is killed by PPR.
Understand. I'm just talking usage in general. Before we could use them without having blue days, at least in my small little section of Delta, we could use them fairly easily because we were better staffed. I remember using 6 or 7 on the same day trip, simply because we had blue days all month long. With that type of coverage, there wasn't a big need to trade with someone. Obviously it wasn't like that all the time, but it was far better than today. Now, it rarely makes it past the evening of the 19th or past the 0700 PCS on the 20th.
Last edited by crewdawg; 04-17-2026 at 01:57 AM.
04-17-2026 | 04:44 AM
#313
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 2,551
Likes: 100
From: Road construction signholder
The complaint from the flight ops email (unsigned because they were too scared to sign it) informing us after the fact that banked payback days were no longer a thing specifically said dropping trips with PB days was "resulting in unnecessary churn for both Crew Scheduling and the operation." Which we all know is patently false because, as you said, it goes on another pilot's schedule, not into open time. The trip is never uncovered. So they're finally admitting this is all about money.
I wonder how many senior FOs who chose to bid reserve, volunteer to fly on their days off, as a mutually beneficial quid with the company, will still want to do that, all for extra vacation days 18 months in the future? Few I'll bet. The company gets no sympathy from me when that backfires.
04-17-2026 | 05:40 AM
#314
Roll’n Thunder
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 5,109
Likes: 520
From: Pilot
Understand. I'm just talking usage in general. Before we could use them without having blue days, at least in my small little section of Delta, we could use them fairly easily because we were better staffed. I remember using 6 or 7 on the same day trip, simply because we had blue days all month long. With that type of coverage, there wasn't a big need to trade with someone. Obviously it wasn't like that all the time, but it was far better than today. Now, it rarely makes it past the evening of the 19th or past the 0700 PCS on the 20th.
04-17-2026 | 06:04 AM
#315
Moderator
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 7,413
Likes: 413
Just to be clear, the main reason you need a partner, even with all blue days, is because washing PB days nets you pay and credit, so you can only wash by yourself up to the WS pickup limit. Unless you’re clearing your schedule first or have a month with vacation, most people could only wash a handful solo before needing a helping hand.
Understood, I wasn't intending to dive into every single nuance of the PB day washing. To your point, the bolded part is my situation most months and was so back in the time in question. But that's not really the point from the conversation above. Back then, there was no swapping with pilots to make this happen (yes we were limited by the WS PU limit) and this was something the that they now allow. They clearly agreed to the change away from this, so I'm not sure why they're so surprised by the results. If I had to place a bet, my money is they're trying to negotiate back to using all available PB days for the number days per trip dropped and no PB days on days traded with a buddy. They can do that, but we need extract something of value to do it.
04-17-2026 | 06:35 AM
#316
Roll’n Thunder
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 5,109
Likes: 520
From: Pilot
Understood, I wasn't intending to dive into every single nuance of the PB day washing. To your point, the bolded part is my situation most months and was so back in the time in question. But that's not really the point from the conversation above. Back then, there was no swapping with pilots to make this happen (yes we were limited by the WS PU limit) and this was something the that they now allow. They clearly agreed to the change away from this, so I'm not sure why they're so surprised by the results. If I had to place a bet, my money is they're trying to negotiate back to using all available PB days for the number days per trip dropped and no PB days on days traded with a buddy. They can do that, but we need extract something of value to do it.
04-17-2026 | 06:41 AM
#317
On Reserve
Joined: Oct 2019
Posts: 147
Likes: 15
Just to be clear, the main reason you need a partner, even with all blue days, is because washing PB days nets you pay and credit, so you can only wash by yourself up to the WS pickup limit. Unless you’re clearing your schedule first or have a month with vacation, most people could only wash a handful solo before needing a helping hand.
04-17-2026 | 06:49 AM
#318
Roll’n Thunder
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 5,109
Likes: 520
From: Pilot
For the sake of future readers, I'll point out that this is also not quite correct. After you hit the WS pickup limit, you can still pick up any trip off the swap board (not affected by WS pickup limit), then trade that trip for the trip you want to drop (swap with the pot), then continue dropping it in this way. You still rely on blue days for this method, though, but it's a way around the WS pickup limit.
04-17-2026 | 07:24 AM
#319
On Reserve
Joined: Sep 2017
Posts: 184
Likes: 6
That statement from mgmt clowns is a perfect example of their lying. They hate banked PB day washing strictly due to the money they are paying out. PB day washing, while costly (and I get their angst as they look at spreadsheets) actually results in a more stable operation.
I wonder how many senior FOs who chose to bid reserve, volunteer to fly on their days off, as a mutually beneficial quid with the company, will still want to do that, all for extra vacation days 18 months in the future? Few I'll bet. The company gets no sympathy from me when that backfires.
I wonder how many senior FOs who chose to bid reserve, volunteer to fly on their days off, as a mutually beneficial quid with the company, will still want to do that, all for extra vacation days 18 months in the future? Few I'll bet. The company gets no sympathy from me when that backfires.
RG and HT have no idea what they've done and what's in store for them. It's going to be bad. The only thing that could possibly save them is high jet fuel prices.
04-17-2026 | 08:13 AM
#320
On Reserve
Joined: Feb 2013
Posts: 146
Likes: 73
If I was the company I would be claiming global instability and rough waters ahead. (How are we going to fly to Europe in a few weeks if they don't have jet fuel over there? Or Asia?) How do events like these normally affect negotiations? What's the argument against it?
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