I'm just glad they didn't mention the dreaded (insert DOM DOM DOMMMM! sound effect here), dare I say its name? Plan C...total and complete annihilation of the pilot group surely the end state.

 

so says you,

I have as much evidence that we'd have gotten a better contract as someone has that turning it down would've been worse.

 

Good advice. We haven't hit any points yet where the TA rationale has been debunked, nor validated.

I don't think I'm alone in detecting some back-pedalling by SD, and I'm also unconvinced by the arguments that the economy is turning against us more than it was already against us. I don't really see any new factors now that didn't exist in June, which might justify a change in the plan. In particular, I'm unimpressed with the European "surprise" argument. That's a little bit like saying we all agreed the train was derailing, but we weren't sure of how the fourth and fith cars would fare, and everything is different now that they're coming off the rails.

I also suspect that we're seeing a deliberate shift away from direct flights, and into feeding the JV hubs.

But for now, it's too early to draw lasting conclusions about the TA.

 

so if we merge with Hawaiian, how much capacity do we have to cut post merger?

 

Probably only furlough up to about seniority #9000 or so.

 

Not necessarily in this order but see any patterns emerging. Some will say whatever is necessary to get what they want. Some will believe what is said every time no matter how many times they get duped.

Delta tells Cinci we are here to stay and not shrinking if merger approved.

Merger is approved and we have only a few flights left now.



Delta tells Delta pilots we will get a bunch of increased flying if we lobby with them to get the slot swap for LGA.

We lobby/win and find out Delta forgot to tell us most of the new flying is DCI RJ’s


Delta tells MSP we are there to stay and will keep jobs in the area with training and some headquarters if merger approved (remember the questioning by then Transportation Committee Chairman James Oberstar).

Less than three years after the merger was approved most of the training and NWA headquarters moved to ATL (Delta did pay a monetary penalty for this as MSP dignitaries didn't trust the double talk and in the end they we smart to be skeptical and require penalties if Delta didn’t follow through on promises).


Delta/ALPA imply, hint, suggest hiring to begin by the end of 2012 if we pass TA2012. The ALPA marketing machine puts out bogus numbers for hiring if we vote in TA2012 that evaporate within a couple short months because of …..wait for it…..the economy that’s exactly the same as it was when such statements were made.


ALPA says we will not hurry the negotiations for TA2012 if it causes us to marginalize the goals of our pilot group as reflected in the TA2012 survey.

ALPA does a 180, abrogates its promises, keeps its membership in the dark and hard sells an inferior agreement that is sold as hiring positive (see above).


ALPA promises to release Flight Pay Loss data when put under pressure by its constituents.

ALPA fails to produce such numbers and by now have swept all this under the carpet.


And so on and so on and so on…….

 

I thought it was fairly explicit that some items were concessionary, and I thought it was pretty clear that the initial staffing result was expected to be roughly neutral. I think it was also fairly explicit that, without letting them be tied to a number, the reps suggested there would be a need for a lot of pilots in the near future assuming the company can stick to the plan. I don't see new elements to justify a departure from the plan, but since we don't have deliveries until later next year, I don't think we can excited until we get into 2013.

Still, I agree with much of your post above, especially since I fear we might be unhappy with the FTDT results. I say this because we haven't been polled on what we might or might not be willing to trade for what might or might not be on the table. I'm also concerned that a very significant agreement, which the reps acknowledged would be an oportunity to further negotiate, might be implemented without MEMRAT. I have no info that this will be the case, so I might just be paranoid, but I don't have a great feeling about the FTDT outcome yet.

I'll be glad to be proven wrong, and I imagine you feel the same way?

 

Alpha,

I don't think you want to provide any proof to the RJDC/DFR crowd. Lets just say Comair was hosed no matter which way DALPA voted on this TA.

You start taking credit for shutting down Comair, and you'll work up some of the 5%ers at my airline. Then one of my 5%ers gets one of your 5%ers all worked up, and pretty soon Boomer never gets a job anywhere ever again. Deal?

 

Delta tells Memphis pilots that the base is "Here to stay" and less than two months later it's closed with a suprise AE and the pilots have 10 days from the announcement to decide on a bid and get it in for their new base.

 

Anyone else find this upsetting? Always held the management team in high regard, but this makes me feel like my "dream job" is actually working for Ali Baba and the 40 thieves.

Disgraceful.