Any "Latest & Greatest" about Delta?
02-27-2013 | 07:18 AM
veut gagner à la loterie
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 23,286
Likes: 0
From: Light Chop
02-27-2013 | 07:19 AM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 12,831
Likes: 172
From: window seat
Three years was a big carve out, but it was allowed because we had airplanes down for mod lines and we picked up nearly 2% as Alitalia came into the mix.
I think most concur that the measurement window needs to be tightened. A 12 month rolling average make sense as airlines adjust their seasonal flying for different parts of the World.
02-27-2013 | 07:33 AM
veut gagner à la loterie
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 23,286
Likes: 0
From: Light Chop
Contrary to many recent posts, I see most reserves are sitting at home getting paid to grow a beard. Most widebody reserves aren't getting close to half the ALV, much less to the ALV. "Yeah but wait till summer" you say. Well, hmmm..., isn't that how things always are in this industry? Summertime flying picks up and pilots fly more? Or did I miss something?
The entire ALV+15, while I admit concessionary, isn't going to be nearly as onerous as you think, due to those pesky things called FARs. There is no way a domestic pilot is going to be flying 95 hours a month except as a statistical outlier--it certainly won't be the norm. Further, the 7 short call thing only takes effect when the new FT/DT rules are in effect, which limits any short call (domestic or international) to 14 hours.
The true reason for ALV+15 was the long 12-14 day trips flying to the Pacific that in the summertime frequently are worth 85+ hours.
Under the old contract if a pilot sicked out of one of those, not one reserve in the entire airline would be eligible to be assigned it, even if he had 15 or more continuous on call days, because you could not be assigned a trip that would cause you to exceed the ALV.
In prior eras, DAL (south) rarely had such trips, but the NWA side always did.
I do not believe it is unreasonable for the company to expect a reserve with zero hours to be assigned a published trip completely over his on call days. Any reserve in a WB category whose line started out with 18 straight on call days (which is common in such categories) should be eligible for such. Apparently the thinking on this forum disagrees.
As for "reserves are going to be slaughtered." I disagree. Reserves flying a bunch over summer?...yes, but isn't that what the airline industry is all about? At least now they have the calendar day average going for them, which applies to reserves and deadhead-only duty periods. While not perfect, now a two-day trip is always worth at least 9 hours to a reserve, where it might have only been worth four before!
Last, despite lots of complaints here, I believe that we would have furloughed long ago except for two things:
RA truly doesn't want to rock the boat with all the strategic moves he has in mind, and I think he has accepted the price of peace by having temporarily surplus pilot staffing.
The contractual provision that mandates the company remove all seats over 70 from every DCI aircraft if mainline so much as furloughs one pilot. Further, this isn't subject to force majeure and is much more effective than a blanket no-furlough clause which we have all seen is about worthless. If management wants the 76 seaters so bad--and apparantly they do--then it will be costly indeed to furlough anyone from the mainline.
The entire ALV+15, while I admit concessionary, isn't going to be nearly as onerous as you think, due to those pesky things called FARs. There is no way a domestic pilot is going to be flying 95 hours a month except as a statistical outlier--it certainly won't be the norm. Further, the 7 short call thing only takes effect when the new FT/DT rules are in effect, which limits any short call (domestic or international) to 14 hours.
The true reason for ALV+15 was the long 12-14 day trips flying to the Pacific that in the summertime frequently are worth 85+ hours.
Under the old contract if a pilot sicked out of one of those, not one reserve in the entire airline would be eligible to be assigned it, even if he had 15 or more continuous on call days, because you could not be assigned a trip that would cause you to exceed the ALV.
In prior eras, DAL (south) rarely had such trips, but the NWA side always did.
I do not believe it is unreasonable for the company to expect a reserve with zero hours to be assigned a published trip completely over his on call days. Any reserve in a WB category whose line started out with 18 straight on call days (which is common in such categories) should be eligible for such. Apparently the thinking on this forum disagrees.
As for "reserves are going to be slaughtered." I disagree. Reserves flying a bunch over summer?...yes, but isn't that what the airline industry is all about? At least now they have the calendar day average going for them, which applies to reserves and deadhead-only duty periods. While not perfect, now a two-day trip is always worth at least 9 hours to a reserve, where it might have only been worth four before!
Last, despite lots of complaints here, I believe that we would have furloughed long ago except for two things:
RA truly doesn't want to rock the boat with all the strategic moves he has in mind, and I think he has accepted the price of peace by having temporarily surplus pilot staffing.
The contractual provision that mandates the company remove all seats over 70 from every DCI aircraft if mainline so much as furloughs one pilot. Further, this isn't subject to force majeure and is much more effective than a blanket no-furlough clause which we have all seen is about worthless. If management wants the 76 seaters so bad--and apparantly they do--then it will be costly indeed to furlough anyone from the mainline.
This is kind of a big issue with me on the PWA outside of Section 1. If you have 7,000 credit hours you need to have flown by reserves, with a cap of 70 hours you'd need 100 reserves. With a cap of 80, you need 88 pilots and with a cap of 85 you only need 82. That flying is done by fewer pilots, not moved over to regular pilots. (sorry, digress from your post)
When I said weekend reserves being slaughtered, what I mean is right now and for months those pilots have routinely flown into buckets 3 and 4 while weekends off pilots may have flown accumulated a grand RAW score of 0 and 0 SCs. The disparity there is huge and has been since the weekend coverage numbers were changed. Now this will be the first summer with the new ALV+15 which they have not had until recently. This crowd are the reserve pilots that get assigned 4 days the day before they start reserve and never sit SC unless it's after a trip.
If you had 4 weekends in the month these weekend warriors might fly 3 four days in the first three weeks and head into week 4 with 69 hours. Before they were done, now they can do another 4 day and go to 92 hours. It's not 95, but it's close.
As to why we didn't furlough, I agree, there is the traditional labor peace aspect of let's not put people on the street but also prior to becoming one merged airline which side would they have furloughed from? That would've been a disaster.
02-27-2013 | 07:38 AM
Da Hudge
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 17,473
Likes: 0
From: Poodle Whisperer
FTB, I'm a weekends off pilot and have sat 6 short calls- flown 4 of those. In February!! Summer is going to be fun...
02-27-2013 | 07:52 AM
On Reserve
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 1,886
Likes: 0
From: MSP7ERB
You're not full until you exceed ALV. Once you exceed ALV, you can't be assigned any more trips; but you still have to complete the one you're currently on (which could be as high as ALV+15). ALV-2 is the reserve guarantee.
02-27-2013 | 07:54 AM
Da Hudge
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 17,473
Likes: 0
From: Poodle Whisperer
Whoops, ftb is right! I thought rsv guarantee maxed at 78, it's 80.
At 79:59 you're on the hook for another 17:01 of credit involuntarily.
At 79:59 you're on the hook for another 17:01 of credit involuntarily.
02-27-2013 | 08:00 AM
veut gagner à la loterie
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 23,286
Likes: 0
From: Light Chop
I think you know they're short when you're getting trips without SCs.
02-27-2013 | 08:03 AM
On Reserve
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 1,886
Likes: 0
From: MSP7ERB
When I said weekend reserves being slaughtered, what I mean is right now and for months those pilots have routinely flown into buckets 3 and 4 while weekends off pilots may have flown accumulated a grand RAW score of 0 and 0 SCs. The disparity there is huge and has been since the weekend coverage numbers were changed. Now this will be the first summer with the new ALV+15 which they have not had until recently. This crowd are the reserve pilots that get assigned 4 days the day before they start reserve and never sit SC unless it's after a trip.
02-27-2013 | 08:13 AM
Da Hudge
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 17,473
Likes: 0
From: Poodle Whisperer
The other time, they gave me a 2 hour dhd callout and when they realized I wasn't going to make that departure, they no-op'd me. Later that day they gave me another 2 hour dhd callout when it was completely unnecessary... so I deviated.
02-27-2013 | 08:13 AM
veut gagner à la loterie
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 23,286
Likes: 0
From: Light Chop
Alright,
Looking at the ALVs in PBS for March this matches.
MAX RESERVE AND RESERVE FULL
Beginning with the December bid period, PWA Section 23 S.2.a.1 becomes effective. Previously, a reserve pilot would not be assigned a rotation that would cause his credit to exceed the ALV. The new language will allow a pilot with whose accumulated monthly block and credit is below the reserve guarantee to be assigned a rotation as long as it does not cause his credit to exceed the ALV plus 15 hours.
Also in the December bid period, Section 23 S.2.d. becomes effective. This states a pilot will not be required to remain on call after his accumulated credit equals or exceeds his reserve guarantee. However, Crew Scheduling will attempt to contact a pilot who is on a reserve on-call day the last day of the current bid period to advise him of an assignment to a rotation or short call if on a reserve on-call day the first day of the next bid period.
So as I see it, reserve guarantee is somewhere between 72-80 hours, if you haven't exceeded that you can be assigned a trip as long as you don't go above ALV+15.
4.C.1. Reserve Line Guarantee: The line guarantee of a reserve pilot for credit purposes will be his ALV minus two hours, but no less than 72 hours and no more than 80 hours,...
So reserve guarantee is ALV - 2 hours. But it cannot be less than 72 hours and cannot be greater than 80.23.A.2. ―Average line valu (ALV) means a number of hours established by the Company between 72 and 84 hours (inclusive) that is the projected average of all regular line values, for a position, for a bid period.
So min ALV is 72 hours and max is 84. Reserve guarantee is not 70-82 hours but instead has it's floor and cap limits of 72-80 hours. Looking at the ALVs in PBS for March this matches.
- ATL 330B ALV is 72 hours, RES GUAR is therefore at the min 72 hours.
- ATL 320A ALV is 84 hours (the ALV limit), the RES GUAR is therefore 80 hours or the max reserve guarantee.
- ATL 320B ALV however is 76 hours and thus the RES GUAR is 74 hours or 76 hours minus 2 hours which is 74. [/INDENT]
23.S.2.a.1): A reserve pilot will not be assigned a ration that will cause his credit to exceed the ALV plus 15 hours.
23.S.2.d.: A reserve pilot will not be required to remain on call after his accumulated credit equals or exceeds his reserve guarantee.
The best summary here is from the December Crew Planning news: MAX RESERVE AND RESERVE FULL
Beginning with the December bid period, PWA Section 23 S.2.a.1 becomes effective. Previously, a reserve pilot would not be assigned a rotation that would cause his credit to exceed the ALV. The new language will allow a pilot with whose accumulated monthly block and credit is below the reserve guarantee to be assigned a rotation as long as it does not cause his credit to exceed the ALV plus 15 hours.
Also in the December bid period, Section 23 S.2.d. becomes effective. This states a pilot will not be required to remain on call after his accumulated credit equals or exceeds his reserve guarantee. However, Crew Scheduling will attempt to contact a pilot who is on a reserve on-call day the last day of the current bid period to advise him of an assignment to a rotation or short call if on a reserve on-call day the first day of the next bid period.
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
