If GS are so unfair, then let me ask this rethorical question: are the 1.5X>80 proponents willing to make sure the open time is distributed evenly throughout each category list?

 

I'd vote for that in a heartbeat.

 

You mean all that open time that used to be flown by the 30% reserves we used to have to staff every category, when we had a 75hr. cap?

We are down to less than 20% reserves required, because now that there is no 75hr. cap, guys can white slip up to ALV+15, and they can swap a 10hr. 2 day for a 30hr. 4 day, and get well over 100 hr. month.

Yeah, that probably has no effect...

 

and:

Originally Posted by forgot to bid
From talking to the merger committee folks the end money given to the pilot group between the time and a half pay NWA used to get and the greenslip system was a wash proportionally. However, the greenslip system was spread out whereas the 1.5X system was heavily in favor of senior pilots.

Thanks for making this very pertinent point. I never thought about it that way, but there is no way 1.5>80 will be more fair than GS (quite the opposite). This is because access to open time is straight seniority, whereas GS has a distribution mechanism to send flying down. Anyone that's in a category that's even remotely fat knows that the flying never trickles down very far, AND we all see people engaging in various "social bdding" practices, and bidding mafias, to snake a disproportional amount of flying to themselves and their friends. I just saw it done in person not long ago, and it's pretty disgusting. Not illegal perhaps, but disgusting nonetheless.

Interestingly, when some F/A's were found out doing same (bidding on open time for friends that were airborne at the time), they were canned.

 

From the company: The AE’s run first and they will fill all 145 positions or to the max amount of people who bid it. Next the MD’s run and it will look at their bid and determine if there is a junior pilot in the category or if there is a vacancy. If there is not a junior pilot to them, it will move on to their next choice.

From the union: The top most senior 145 AE’s would initially populate those positions. Then the system goes back and looks at Mandatory Displacements.

From me: So my understanding is they just run the AEs and if 0 pilots being displaced (767/DC9) bid the 717 on an AE then on the first run they're not put into the plane. 0 will be awarded the 717. However, the next run they do the MDs and that's when the 767/DC9 guys who bid the 717 on an MD (and wanted it) will get to hold it and knock junior pilots down below them until they knock people off. Then they post it. So for the DC9/767 guys, they luck out in that there are no category freezes off their MD and they'll hold it if their seniority was going to hold it in the first place. You end up in the same place. But it's also why that count thing on icrew is so worthless.

I'm still saying 1601 on March 19th.



And let's have an even bigger pool, how many times does someone ask if the AE is out?

 

Yeahbut...you forgot about the VD's!

 

Now I figured they run a test today so I hope my bidding all NYC screws things up.

 

VDs are fun, and the best part about a VD is you can get one this time around. It's a free pass!!!!

Wait, what are we talking about?

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BTW, I'm not big into this whole AE stuff so what's the reason why VDs don't count this time on the 717 again? Because the 717 is new right?

 

They must not have been Asian. This practice is still going on with FAs, the Asian Mafia is very active in this and has a robo-program that grabs open time and distributes it. At least that is how it has been explained to me.

 

Are you talking about the 24mo. Training Freeze in any old category, that doesn't count, but only if going into a New Category (717 in this bid)?

A VD is simply a more senior pilot who wants out of his category, but is too senior to be MD'd out, and there is no A/E (that he can hold) into another category he'd like to move to.

In that case, he can take the junior guy's MD (in his category) out, to try to get into that other category, but only if the junior guy who's MD he's VD'ng can hold that other category.