Any "Latest & Greatest" about Delta?
09-03-2009, 06:49 AM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2005
Posts: 2,002
Originally Posted by tsquare
You are right... you did not take a paycut in this merger.... and besides... waaaaaaaaah Paycut.. puhleeeeez 
09-03-2009, 06:50 AM
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Joined APC: Aug 2006
Position: Captain, CRJ-200, ASA
Posts: 876
Originally Posted by acl65pilot
Bringing pilots in at the top end of the pay and bennifit scales is not cost effective. Maybe a 3-1 ratio might work, but there has to be some sort of savings there. (The current practice is cheaper for them. We need to be realistic on this effect)
09-03-2009, 06:53 AM
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Joined APC: Aug 2006
Position: Captain, CRJ-200, ASA
Posts: 876
Originally Posted by Bucking Bar
Yep.
Joe & John, you are actually hurting your case by bringing it here. A better venue for your concerns is your own Reps, not a bunch of Delta line pilots.
Joe & John, you are actually hurting your case by bringing it here. A better venue for your concerns is your own Reps, not a bunch of Delta line pilots.
And I disagree 100% with your statement. The hard sell on any kind of get-together will be on the Delta line pilots, not management. There are too many pilots over there who think we're not worthy. That attitude needs to change. Fortunately SOME in your group don't feel that way. SOME of them are even running for ALPA office. Change comes slowly, but it WILL come.
Originally Posted by Bucking Bar
Already the ugly "who's better" debate has begun.
Originally Posted by Bucking Bar
It can't be proven, but my suspicions are that the majority is going to find the military pilot who beat our 2,500 candidates for his flight spot is going to be hard to beat. Also the SR-71 pilots have the best stories, or at least the ones they can tell.
09-03-2009, 06:58 AM
Happy to be here
Joined APC: Jun 2006
Position: A-320A
Posts: 18,563
Originally Posted by John Pennekamp
What if we came in at our current pay scale? In other words, a B scale on your contract? I believe management would buy that.
The greater of year one/two pay on our PWA, or your pay. Fact is that except the top people at DCI, most will be at a better composite rate in two to three years on our contract. Year three as of Jan 1 2010 on the 88 is 88.00 an hr and year two is 75.13. If you look at the 767 rates for next year are: Year two is 85.70 and year three is 100.29. That right there is almost what a 18 year CRJ CA makes at EV.
09-03-2009, 07:00 AM
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Joined APC: Jun 2006
Position: A-320A
Posts: 18,563
Originally Posted by John Pennekamp
News Flash! My reps and your reps are CURRENT NEGOTIATING exactly what we're discussing!
And I disagree 100% with your statement. The hard sell on any kind of get-together will be on the Delta line pilots, not management. There are too many pilots over there who think we're not worthy. That attitude needs to change. Fortunately SOME in your group don't feel that way. SOME of them are even running for ALPA office. Change comes slowly, but it WILL come.
And you're perpetuating it. Evidence your post below. (Hypocrite)
So 300 hours of single engine fighter time makes someone a better airline pilot than 8000 hours of 121 airline time? Got it!
And I disagree 100% with your statement. The hard sell on any kind of get-together will be on the Delta line pilots, not management. There are too many pilots over there who think we're not worthy. That attitude needs to change. Fortunately SOME in your group don't feel that way. SOME of them are even running for ALPA office. Change comes slowly, but it WILL come.
And you're perpetuating it. Evidence your post below. (Hypocrite)
So 300 hours of single engine fighter time makes someone a better airline pilot than 8000 hours of 121 airline time? Got it!
If you want to talk about this lets talk, do not point fingers. The harsh reality is that DAL pilots control if this happens.
09-03-2009, 07:01 AM
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Joined APC: Apr 2008
Posts: 478
John,
You still haven't answered my question. Why should "you" (sli flow up pilots) carry their pay over to Delta when almost EVERYONE here had to give up theirs?? I took a bet (sacrificed short term pay) for longer term pay (career at Delta) as did everyone here. Why should you be different?
You still haven't answered my question. Why should "you" (sli flow up pilots) carry their pay over to Delta when almost EVERYONE here had to give up theirs?? I took a bet (sacrificed short term pay) for longer term pay (career at Delta) as did everyone here. Why should you be different?
09-03-2009, 07:02 AM
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Joined APC: Aug 2006
Position: Captain, CRJ-200, ASA
Posts: 876
Originally Posted by acl65pilot
John, go look at one my posts a few back. There is a sort of pay protection in place at CPS if we flow down, something like this could work in a flow up.
The greater of year one/two pay on our PWA, or your pay. Fact is that except the top people at DCI, most will be at a better composite rate in two to three years on our contract. Year three as of Jan 1 2010 on the 88 is 88.00 an hr and year two is 75.13. If you look at the 767 rates for next year are: Year two is 85.70 and year three is 100.29. That right there is almost what a 18 year CRJ CA makes at EV.
The greater of year one/two pay on our PWA, or your pay. Fact is that except the top people at DCI, most will be at a better composite rate in two to three years on our contract. Year three as of Jan 1 2010 on the 88 is 88.00 an hr and year two is 75.13. If you look at the 767 rates for next year are: Year two is 85.70 and year three is 100.29. That right there is almost what a 18 year CRJ CA makes at EV.
09-03-2009, 07:03 AM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Aug 2006
Position: Captain, CRJ-200, ASA
Posts: 876
Originally Posted by acl65pilot
John, stop it, this kind of crud will back the majority of DAL pilots in to their corner with their teeth out. Keep it respectable. This is exactly why this failed almost a decade ago.
If you want to talk about this lets talk, do not point fingers. The harsh reality is that DAL pilots control if this happens.
If you want to talk about this lets talk, do not point fingers. The harsh reality is that DAL pilots control if this happens.
09-03-2009, 07:04 AM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Aug 2006
Position: Captain, CRJ-200, ASA
Posts: 876
Originally Posted by Rather B Fishin
John,
You still haven't answered my question. Why should "you" (sli flow up pilots) carry their pay over to Delta when almost EVERYONE here had to give up theirs?? I took a bet (sacrificed short term pay) for longer term pay (career at Delta) as did everyone here. Why should you be different?
You still haven't answered my question. Why should "you" (sli flow up pilots) carry their pay over to Delta when almost EVERYONE here had to give up theirs?? I took a bet (sacrificed short term pay) for longer term pay (career at Delta) as did everyone here. Why should you be different?
09-03-2009, 07:10 AM
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Joined APC: Jun 2006
Position: A-320A
Posts: 18,563
Originally Posted by John Pennekamp
I see your point. I really don't have a good solution for that. Do you suggest EV pilots (highest paid in DCI) would need to take pay cuts to make it "fair" for the low seniority DAL pilots? And really, why isn't it fair? We already make more than them. Stapling the lists really doesn't change anything.
Like I said the solution is the greater of the two. As with any deal the reality is that all sides will have to give and take. That is the reality. The question is how bad you want this and what are you willing to do to make it happen. That holds true for our side as well.
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