Any "Latest & Greatest" about Delta?
11-10-2013 | 06:50 AM
No longer cares
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From: 767er Captain
11-10-2013 | 07:13 AM
Line Holder
Joined: Apr 2009
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Cohiba,
I live in DFW, so lots of in network(all my doc's). I'm just covering myself and a child. They look like the same coverage(preventive 100%, co-insurance in-network 80/20, out of 60/140 and prescrips the same) The only difference I see is the deductibles of 1150/2300 vs 2150/4300. Unless I'm missing something(highly likely) in a worst case max deductible situation I'm out an extra $550 family and $350 individual with the silver. If my usage is like last year which was standard(annual checkup for my son and I, and usually one or two visits each for a cold or other minor issue((knock on wood it continues this way)) So for me it looks like if I have another status quo year I save $700 dollars per year with the silver. I do agree if you go out of network it is a no-brainer. What am I missing?
I live in DFW, so lots of in network(all my doc's). I'm just covering myself and a child. They look like the same coverage(preventive 100%, co-insurance in-network 80/20, out of 60/140 and prescrips the same) The only difference I see is the deductibles of 1150/2300 vs 2150/4300. Unless I'm missing something(highly likely) in a worst case max deductible situation I'm out an extra $550 family and $350 individual with the silver. If my usage is like last year which was standard(annual checkup for my son and I, and usually one or two visits each for a cold or other minor issue((knock on wood it continues this way)) So for me it looks like if I have another status quo year I save $700 dollars per year with the silver. I do agree if you go out of network it is a no-brainer. What am I missing?
If you have a family with little kids, definitely DO NOT do the Silver HRA. The biggest plus for it is what you identified-low premiums. The negative is the deductible side. Both in-network & out-of-network is high and we've had several instances where a family has a castrophic event using the Silver HRA and gets hit with massive $20k+ bills. The Silver HRA was designed for healthy younger single person who wants basic coverage and "some" catastrophic protection. If you live in a major Hub like ATL most if not all the medical provides are in-network and most of your needs will be covered. But if you live in an area where UHC isn't pervasive...you should check the costs for max-deductible for out-of-network.
For most pilots...you should be looking at the Gold HRA or HSA and run the medical planner. Most likely the Gold HRA is better unless your family is a major user of medical or needs a lot of meds (HSA includes the meds in their deductibles and the HRAs do not).
For most pilots...you should be looking at the Gold HRA or HSA and run the medical planner. Most likely the Gold HRA is better unless your family is a major user of medical or needs a lot of meds (HSA includes the meds in their deductibles and the HRAs do not).
11-10-2013 | 07:28 AM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Apr 2008
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From: DAL FO
Cohiba,
I live in DFW, so lots of in network(all my doc's). I'm just covering myself and a child. They look like the same coverage(preventive 100%, co-insurance in-network 80/20, out of 60/140 and prescrips the same) The only difference I see is the deductibles of 1150/2300 vs 2150/4300. Unless I'm missing something(highly likely) in a worst case max deductible situation I'm out an extra $550 family and $350 individual with the silver. If my usage is like last year which was standard(annual checkup for my son and I, and usually one or two visits each for a cold or other minor issue((knock on wood it continues this way)) So for me it looks like if I have another status quo year I save $700 dollars per year with the silver. I do agree if you go out of network it is a no-brainer. What am I missing?
I live in DFW, so lots of in network(all my doc's). I'm just covering myself and a child. They look like the same coverage(preventive 100%, co-insurance in-network 80/20, out of 60/140 and prescrips the same) The only difference I see is the deductibles of 1150/2300 vs 2150/4300. Unless I'm missing something(highly likely) in a worst case max deductible situation I'm out an extra $550 family and $350 individual with the silver. If my usage is like last year which was standard(annual checkup for my son and I, and usually one or two visits each for a cold or other minor issue((knock on wood it continues this way)) So for me it looks like if I have another status quo year I save $700 dollars per year with the silver. I do agree if you go out of network it is a no-brainer. What am I missing?
Like scambo said, run the numbers for worst case to determine your max out of pocket should the worst occur. Worst case should be the sum of: annual premium (fixed), family deductible and max coinsurance. That will give you the maximum you could be stuck with out of pocket should something really bad happen next year.
Best case would be if you paid premiums only and no one gets sick or has any medical expenses throughout the year - you could make the case that as long as those expenses don't exceed your delta dollars then it's still $0 out of pocket for expenses. Some guys like to factor in the value of their rollover balance.
Once you have those numbers for each plan it's a risk/reward based on your expected expenses, potential for an unknown (expensive) event, and the best case/worst case numbers. It's all a trade off and what you're comfortable with.
Good luck. I absolutely hate sifting through all this stuff. Glad to have it behind me for another year.
Fwiw, we have a babysitter that watches the kids 3 days a week and we have been able to pay her with dependent FSA dollars for the past several years. Since she's not a business, she just has to sign the claim form and put her tax ID on there. The downside of this is the IRS sees us as an employer so we have to withhold FICA, unemployment, etc for her. To keep it all above the table and pay the CPA to figure it all out decreases the value of the tax benefit, BUT it's still worth it to us, and she gets some benefit in the form of SS contributions (not that it will be around for her to collect) and unemployment should she ever need it when we part ways.
11-10-2013 | 08:06 AM
Line Holder
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 1,688
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Sorry to keep beating this horse, when we could be discussing alpa/dpa or underboob
Ok, if my math is correct in a worse case situation in network only(gold $1908 premium + $2300 deductible + $4500 coinsurance max -$1050 rewards = $7658 out of pocket)(silver $708 + $4300 + $4500 - $550 = $8958) Difference of $1300 savings going with the gold. With only the individual maximums the difference is much smaller $5008(gold) vs $5308(silver). The calculator shows the silver saves me $700 for the year based on our past use, which was a pretty standard year for us.
Ok, if my math is correct in a worse case situation in network only(gold $1908 premium + $2300 deductible + $4500 coinsurance max -$1050 rewards = $7658 out of pocket)(silver $708 + $4300 + $4500 - $550 = $8958) Difference of $1300 savings going with the gold. With only the individual maximums the difference is much smaller $5008(gold) vs $5308(silver). The calculator shows the silver saves me $700 for the year based on our past use, which was a pretty standard year for us.
Look at max coinsurance as well. I ran the numbers a week ago when my wife's company was in open enrollment. I don't remember the exact numbers but the max coinsurance was significantly higher for the silver than gold (if I remember correctly.)
Like scambo said, run the numbers for worst case to determine your max out of pocket should the worst occur. Worst case should be the sum of: annual premium (fixed), family deductible and max coinsurance. That will give you the maximum you could be stuck with out of pocket should something really bad happen next year.
Best case would be if you paid premiums only and no one gets sick or has any medical expenses throughout the year - you could make the case that as long as those expenses don't exceed your delta dollars then it's still $0 out of pocket for expenses. Some guys like to factor in the value of their rollover balance.
Once you have those numbers for each plan it's a risk/reward based on your expected expenses, potential for an unknown (expensive) event, and the best case/worst case numbers. It's all a trade off and what you're comfortable with.
Good luck. I absolutely hate sifting through all this stuff. Glad to have it behind me for another year.
Fwiw, we have a babysitter that watches the kids 3 days a week and we have been able to pay her with dependent FSA dollars for the past several years. Since she's not a business, she just has to sign the claim form and put her tax ID on there. The downside of this is the IRS sees us as an employer so we have to withhold FICA, unemployment, etc for her. To keep it all above the table and pay the CPA to figure it all out decreases the value of the tax benefit, BUT it's still worth it to us, and she gets some benefit in the form of SS contributions (not that it will be around for her to collect) and unemployment should she ever need it when we part ways.
Like scambo said, run the numbers for worst case to determine your max out of pocket should the worst occur. Worst case should be the sum of: annual premium (fixed), family deductible and max coinsurance. That will give you the maximum you could be stuck with out of pocket should something really bad happen next year.
Best case would be if you paid premiums only and no one gets sick or has any medical expenses throughout the year - you could make the case that as long as those expenses don't exceed your delta dollars then it's still $0 out of pocket for expenses. Some guys like to factor in the value of their rollover balance.
Once you have those numbers for each plan it's a risk/reward based on your expected expenses, potential for an unknown (expensive) event, and the best case/worst case numbers. It's all a trade off and what you're comfortable with.
Good luck. I absolutely hate sifting through all this stuff. Glad to have it behind me for another year.
Fwiw, we have a babysitter that watches the kids 3 days a week and we have been able to pay her with dependent FSA dollars for the past several years. Since she's not a business, she just has to sign the claim form and put her tax ID on there. The downside of this is the IRS sees us as an employer so we have to withhold FICA, unemployment, etc for her. To keep it all above the table and pay the CPA to figure it all out decreases the value of the tax benefit, BUT it's still worth it to us, and she gets some benefit in the form of SS contributions (not that it will be around for her to collect) and unemployment should she ever need it when we part ways.
11-10-2013 | 09:18 AM
Moderator
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From: DAL 330
There are a couple of things to think about:
1. Vacation slide happens during the normal line building process. Coverage happens before the normal line building process. PBS cannot slide your vacation into a coverage pairings. Thus, vacation slide has no effect on coverage.
2. It is important to realize that the change is from bottom up denial to top down inclusion. With prefer off, the change is from right to left denial to left to right inclusion.
Even though the right to left has changed it has also been changed from denial to inclusion. In a way very little has changed. The important thing is the top is more important than bottom and in the case of Prefer Off, left is more important to right.
The significant difference between the two is that now PBS is able to consider a lower preference even if it was unable to honor a higher preference. Previously, PBS would have to deny all of he lower Prefer Off, Set Condition, and Avoid preferences in order to remove a higher preference that was the bottle neck. Likewise, PBS will consider a right date even if it was unable to honor a date to the left.
1. Vacation slide happens during the normal line building process. Coverage happens before the normal line building process. PBS cannot slide your vacation into a coverage pairings. Thus, vacation slide has no effect on coverage.
2. It is important to realize that the change is from bottom up denial to top down inclusion. With prefer off, the change is from right to left denial to left to right inclusion.
Even though the right to left has changed it has also been changed from denial to inclusion. In a way very little has changed. The important thing is the top is more important than bottom and in the case of Prefer Off, left is more important to right.
The significant difference between the two is that now PBS is able to consider a lower preference even if it was unable to honor a higher preference. Previously, PBS would have to deny all of he lower Prefer Off, Set Condition, and Avoid preferences in order to remove a higher preference that was the bottle neck. Likewise, PBS will consider a right date even if it was unable to honor a date to the left.
Does paragraph one above basically mean that if you are senior enough to hold those days off without vacation you will be able to slide your vacation onto those days?
Scoop
11-10-2013 | 09:38 AM
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Joined: Dec 2007
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From: DAL 330
Sorry to keep beating this horse, when we could be discussing alpa/dpa or underboob
Ok, if my math is correct in a worse case situation in network only(gold $1908 premium + $2300 deductible + $4500 coinsurance max -$1050 rewards = $7658 out of pocket)(silver $708 + $4300 + $4500 - $550 = $8958) Difference of $1300 savings going with the gold. With only the individual maximums the difference is much smaller $5008(gold) vs $5308(silver). The calculator shows the silver saves me $700 for the year based on our past use, which was a pretty standard year for us.
Ok, if my math is correct in a worse case situation in network only(gold $1908 premium + $2300 deductible + $4500 coinsurance max -$1050 rewards = $7658 out of pocket)(silver $708 + $4300 + $4500 - $550 = $8958) Difference of $1300 savings going with the gold. With only the individual maximums the difference is much smaller $5008(gold) vs $5308(silver). The calculator shows the silver saves me $700 for the year based on our past use, which was a pretty standard year for us.
I was thinking about retiring from the reserves, but I might just stick around for a few more years of TRICARE. Compared to the above our plan for a family of four is:$2400 premium+$300 deductible +1000 maximum out of pocket, for a total of $3700.
I admit since we have been on TRICARE I don't pay too much attention to the DAL plans, but I don't really remember them being that expensive.
Has this been a gradual deterioration over the years or did it all get whacked in BK? Is this part of our contract or are we under the same plan as the non-contract employees?
Scoop
11-10-2013 | 10:05 AM
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Joined: Jan 2010
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ALPA v SWAPA
Copied from another thread:
Ruling just posted.
Arbitrator rejects every aspect of the ALPA argument regarding the B717 sub-lease to Delta.
My personal favorite is from page 46:
Nonetheless, all that evidence shows is that ALPA gambled wrong in the first SLI Agreement when it rejected the terms of the Agreement in the hope of extracting more favorable terms from the Company. When Southwest responded with what ALPA considered a draconian “take it or leave it” offer, ALPA wound up with little leverage to negotiate terms in the second SLI Agreement.
Here come more lawsuits.
Ruling just posted.
Arbitrator rejects every aspect of the ALPA argument regarding the B717 sub-lease to Delta.
My personal favorite is from page 46:
Nonetheless, all that evidence shows is that ALPA gambled wrong in the first SLI Agreement when it rejected the terms of the Agreement in the hope of extracting more favorable terms from the Company. When Southwest responded with what ALPA considered a draconian “take it or leave it” offer, ALPA wound up with little leverage to negotiate terms in the second SLI Agreement.
Here come more lawsuits.
11-10-2013 | 10:19 AM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Apr 2008
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From: DAL FO
Sorry to keep beating this horse, when we could be discussing alpa/dpa or underboob
Ok, if my math is correct in a worse case situation in network only(gold $1908 premium + $2300 deductible + $4500 coinsurance max -$1050 rewards = $7658 out of pocket)(silver $708 + $4300 + $4500 - $550 = $8958) Difference of $1300 savings going with the gold. With only the individual maximums the difference is much smaller $5008(gold) vs $5308(silver). The calculator shows the silver saves me $700 for the year based on our past use, which was a pretty standard year for us.
Ok, if my math is correct in a worse case situation in network only(gold $1908 premium + $2300 deductible + $4500 coinsurance max -$1050 rewards = $7658 out of pocket)(silver $708 + $4300 + $4500 - $550 = $8958) Difference of $1300 savings going with the gold. With only the individual maximums the difference is much smaller $5008(gold) vs $5308(silver). The calculator shows the silver saves me $700 for the year based on our past use, which was a pretty standard year for us.
There's a pretty good comparison chart of all this stuff on the employee self service open enrollment page.
11-10-2013 | 10:29 AM
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From: Road construction signholder
This works for any other holiday period as well.
11-10-2013 | 10:31 AM
Line Holder
Joined: Jul 2009
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Cohiba,
I live in DFW, so lots of in network(all my doc's). I'm just covering myself and a child. They look like the same coverage(preventive 100%, co-insurance in-network 80/20, out of 60/140 and prescrips the same) The only difference I see is the deductibles of 1150/2300 vs 2150/4300. Unless I'm missing something(highly likely) in a worst case max deductible situation I'm out an extra $550 family and $350 individual with the silver. If my usage is like last year which was standard(annual checkup for my son and I, and usually one or two visits each for a cold or other minor issue((knock on wood it continues this way)) So for me it looks like if I have another status quo year I save $700 dollars per year with the silver. I do agree if you go out of network it is a no-brainer. What am I missing?
I live in DFW, so lots of in network(all my doc's). I'm just covering myself and a child. They look like the same coverage(preventive 100%, co-insurance in-network 80/20, out of 60/140 and prescrips the same) The only difference I see is the deductibles of 1150/2300 vs 2150/4300. Unless I'm missing something(highly likely) in a worst case max deductible situation I'm out an extra $550 family and $350 individual with the silver. If my usage is like last year which was standard(annual checkup for my son and I, and usually one or two visits each for a cold or other minor issue((knock on wood it continues this way)) So for me it looks like if I have another status quo year I save $700 dollars per year with the silver. I do agree if you go out of network it is a no-brainer. What am I missing?
You are correct. We had a pilot a couple years ago in SLC whose teenage sons ski race and race snowmobiles. One of the boys crashes the snowmobile and needs to see the best neurosurgeon in the area. $22000 later he's calling for help. The neurosurgeon is out of network. The bottom line is this:
You're balancing cash flow on a month to month basis and that's your Premium cost. Pretty easy to figure. You're balancing the risk/reward issue on your deductibles and a normal year is easy. It's that pit of the stomach and how well you sleep factor that makes it hard.
Personally I use the HSA but this year the 80/20 makes the Gold HRA a better deal. I'll still use the HSA because I can save $6000 in my HSA account and we're heavy users of meds. But...the Silver is the basic no-frills plan and can bite you big if something should happen. It just depends how you roll the dice and sleep.
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