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Old 05-13-2014 | 04:08 AM
  #156271  
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Originally Posted by sinca3
The way I understood it is that it's a physical training problem ( classrooms and sims) not a personnel problem. I think other sim time is being looked at as an option.
Respectfully, why are we discussing how to fix this? It's not our job. That's why there are managers. They manage assets or acquire additional assets (sims, classrooms, instructors). Let them manage. that's what they get well paid to do.
Old 05-13-2014 | 04:17 AM
  #156272  
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Originally Posted by Alan Shore
I would assume so. To which numbers are you referring?
The "lost percentage" from the new contract, on an individual dollar base.
Old 05-13-2014 | 04:19 AM
  #156273  
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Originally Posted by orvil
Respectfully, why are we discussing how to fix this? It's not our job. That's why there are managers. They manage assets or acquire additional assets (sims, classrooms, instructors). Let them manage. that's what they get well paid to do.
True, but if you don't eye-ball them, you better not complain.
Old 05-13-2014 | 04:34 AM
  #156274  
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Case in point, in 1985 when I was bobbing around Tx. in the 73, there was another 73 outfit giving us a hard time. I went over to G.O. and had a talk. They said they were not concerned...We all know how that worked out.
Old 05-13-2014 | 04:35 AM
  #156275  
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Originally Posted by orvil
Respectfully, why are we discussing how to fix this? It's not our job. That's why there are managers. They manage assets or acquire additional assets (sims, classrooms, instructors). Let them manage. that's what they get well paid to do.
Agreed. But the Company will almost certainly come to us for concessions that would somehow reduce the amount of upcoming training required, and I would prefer to help point them in a different direction while there's still time.

Otherwise, I see us faced with the age-old question, "Why won't you help us? Do you really want to see us cut capacity due to a lack of trained pilots?"
Old 05-13-2014 | 04:44 AM
  #156276  
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Originally Posted by Alan Shore
Agreed. But the Company will almost certainly come to us for concessions that would somehow reduce the amount of upcoming training required, and I would prefer to help point them in a different direction while there's still time.

Otherwise, I see us faced with the age-old question, "Why won't you help us? Do you really want to see us cut capacity due to a lack of trained pilots?"
You simply say to the company,

"There is a very easy way to eliminate most of your training issues, forever; pay everyone 777/747 pay."

That will eliminate the need to keep bidding up to higher paying aircraft to enhance your earnings. Everyone could bid what base/aircraft they like the most and stay there forever.

The company is always coming to us expecting us to solve the problems they created. I say, "Fine, but pay us FIRST, then we'll talk about fixing your problems."

Or tell them to call Pauli...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3XGAmPRxV48
Old 05-13-2014 | 04:50 AM
  #156277  
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Originally Posted by Alan Shore
3% increase plus a loss of profit sharing? How often need we do math in public for you to get you to understand (and acknowledge) that the loss of profit sharing was offset against the 8.5% increase in 2013 and that each of the 3% increases are net on top of that?
Here's the problem... we gave up stuff to get that profit sharing (pay increase)... then we gave up the profit sharing (past pay increase) to get the current pay increase... so we gave up stuff twice to get one pay increase... not a good plan.
Old 05-13-2014 | 04:51 AM
  #156278  
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Originally Posted by Alan Shore
Agreed. But the Company will almost certainly come to us for concessions that would somehow reduce the amount of upcoming training required, and I would prefer to help point them in a different direction while there's still time.

Otherwise, I see us faced with the age-old question, "Why won't you help us? Do you really want to see us cut capacity due to a lack of trained pilots?"
The company sustained hiring a 100 pilots a month with fewer sims in the past. They will do fine and contract where needed. No help from us required.
Old 05-13-2014 | 04:52 AM
  #156279  
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Originally Posted by badflaps
Has anyone done the numbers on the profit-share loss?
Yes, the Association did during the road shows. It was about a 2.3% raise or about ~~ 40-43 million. Its a fixed number. As the profit sharing change was below 2.5 and the 33% reduction in profit sharing on a 2.5 billion dollar profit and below is a hard number; IE the 30-43 million dollar number does not change as profits go up. Any profit below 2.5 billion means the rate for reduction in profit sharing pays off. Anything above 2.5 means its effectively equal. Do not forget to add the compounding raises on that initial rate change for the profit sharing change either. In the long run it actually will put more cash in your pocket.
Old 05-13-2014 | 04:55 AM
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Originally Posted by Timbo
The company is always coming to us expecting us to solve the problems they created. I say, "Fine, but pay us FIRST, then we'll talk about fixing your problems."

Or tell them to call Pauli...

Goodfellas: **** You, Pay Me - YouTube
Timbo for MEC Chairman !!
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