Sorry for the topic change but I cannot find any reference to jury duty in the PWA. I already have a trip on the days that I have been summoned, what happens to that trip?

 

Oh, I remember the IAH-ILE/BPT/EFD/HOU/LCH days!

WRT the CDO issue...I don't care as much how many pilots are laying over, as how much credit pilots are accumulating. With only two short legs and a 8-11 hour duty period, the nighttime rig will cause higher credit per "two legs" that can't be eaten up with block time elsewhere in the rotation.

Also, these will be very late show- very early release 4 day rotations with only three duty periods that will pay 22:30 (if they indeed are 7:30 each). That is actually still higher than 5:15/day ADG!

I beleive there will be a significant increase in manning needed due to ADG in general, with all reserves getting 5:15 each day instead of on the end of month "lookback" that we have presently.

Add that with the ADG applying to all the late show and 30 hour layovers that are too long for a CDO, the 18:00 4 days and 13:30 3 days will help a number of lineholders to build a full month of flying with one or two less days of work per month. Those "less days of work" will need to still be flown, so it will require more pilots in category to fly the same schedule.

I think the math on domestic augmentation has shown it likely won't necessarily decrease staffing, but I'm sure there will be reps who ask about that in detail at the meeting.

My money is definitely on the staffing formula going UP rather than DOWN if we ratify this LOA.

I wonder if the net result of the staffing will offset or more than offset the 100-150 pilot "savings" supposedly allowed from C2012?

I wonder what the value of ADG would mean to the Delta pilot payroll as a yearly percentage?

<--- Only sorta waiting patiently for details.

(oh, and I agree with ftb that this will pass with or without memrat)

 

I sailed with one of your cat buddies (Matt McD) this weekend. We gotta get you out with us one of these days. I would love to come down to Kelly for your regatta, but somebody gotta pay the rent. Sail fast....

 

There's a jury duty form online. You need to let the company know ASAP. They will drop as little of your trip as possible so you can make jury duty (could be whole trip). You will be paid for the dropped part of your trip. If you do not let the company know in a timely manner, it will be dropped without pay (yes this has happened). Jury duty is referenced in section 12 of the PWA.

 

Again, more speculation from the usual characters. I tried to make this point earlier... if the items being discussed have been fleshed out so well and the company, who likely sold the benefits through a powerpoint presentation on specific usages and theaters of operation....then both sides should have no problem allowing the pilot group to "snap back" to our current work rules if it doesn't turn out as lollipops and unicorns. Would you support a snapback clause as a get out of jail free card? If no, why not? Oh the company wouldn't agree to that? Why???

 

Ahhhh the mythical staffing formula. Is that the same one that allows categories to be woefully understaffed year after year?

I don't believe it really exists. It is merely cocaine to placate the masses. (us)

 

I know some people like them. It gives the time at home during the day to do whatever they want/need and then they get their sleep during the CDO. I don't care how many people like them... it still doesn't make them safe!

And okay, I'll buy (to an extent) the argument that we already do other types of flying that mess with our sleep cycles. I'm with you on the 30 hour layovers and converting a late night cycle to an early morning cycle. I don't like that either but it's a lot more doable than trying to exist on 3 or 4 hours of sleep on a CDO or series of CDO's. We already have trips at Delta that provide challenges to getting proper rest. Let's not add more trips that are even worse. CDO's are worse. Why are we selling out safety?

 

To each their own, really. A trip with 3 or 4 630am sign-ins is very fatiguing for me. A trip with all late flying that ends at 2-3 in the morning kills other people and is absolutely ideal for me.


In other news, Junior A330 FO at US was just awarded to a May 2013 hire. Dang.

 

You, FTB and I share a disposition toward similar sleep cycles. Every person has an internal clock effected by light/dark/moon etc and they tilt one way or the other (morning person vs night owl). If the FAA/airlines were really interested in safety they would work harder at creating pure AM and pure PM flying that consistently maintain either early show times or late show times but not a mixture of both in one trip. No such luck though and a missed opportunity during the part 117 rule implementation. Let's go ahead and add one more fatigue inducing flights to the list though. That ought to help.

Circadian Rhythm Disorders: Shift Work, Jet Lag, and More

Delayed Sleep Phase Syndrome - What It Is And How To Treat It

Another interesting study, rats that were denied any restorative sleep for many days, simply died. Any time you cut into the natural restorative sleep cycle you start asking for health and safety issues.

Sleep deprivation in the rat: III. Total sleep depriva... [Sleep. 1989] - PubMed - NCBI

"Ten rats were subjected to total sleep deprivation (TSD) by the disk apparatus. All TSD rats died or were sacrificed when death seemed imminent....No anatomical cause of death was identified. All TSD rats showed a debilitated appearance, lesions on their tails and paws, and weight loss in spite of increased food intake. Their yoked control (TSC) rats remained healthy."

 

worse trips for me were the four days.

and specifically the ones that had you do the last flight in and then again the next night but to a min rest overnight and now do a 6am and then 545am to a 13 hour duty day. i hated those. i like far 117.