Originally Posted by Check Essential

They kicked us out for the detailed discussion about the money. Proprietary info.
However, the $40 million is a net number. The +114 pilots is net.

The 5+15 ADG is [B]big dollars[/B


This is total bs. They run the costing without the sdp. I bet if they run the costing with the sdp in the bid packages it's far less. Come on. These sdp eliminate the
30 hour layovers the drivers of credit. Without the 30 hour layovers and the sdp I bet the cost will be nil




It affects many, many current rotations. It also affects manning. More pilots are going to be required to cover the schedule. It especially helps reserves. Getting reserve pay equal to regular pay is something we have been trying to get for a long time.

That is offset by the SDPs. Even with the premium pay, those will save the company big dollars. And it will also save them pilots.

There were compromises. The MEC is going to debate all of this tomorrow.
It is far from certain that

Originally Posted by Whidbey

So on a 2300 launch, midnight land, half hour car time on either side of three hours of rack time, we're on the hook for up to nine hours of dealing with ground stops, delays, etc?

I'm a no on this single issue. This is well beyond trading work rules for pay and into trading safety for pay.

One more thought- guys are talking about the 88 fleet seeing a lot of this, but lets remember that we're bringing a lot of RJ block hours to mainline. To see the potential for the company to use these things going forward, we need to be looking at how they're done at DCI carriers, now how they could be made to fit current bid packages.

Originally Posted by Whidbey

So on a 2300 launch, midnight land, half hour car time on either side of three hours of rack time, we're on the hook for up to nine hours of dealing with ground stops, delays, etc?

I'm a no on this single issue. This is well beyond trading work rules for pay and into trading safety for pay.

One more thought- guys are talking about the 88 fleet seeing a lot of this, but lets remember that we're bringing a lot of RJ block hours to mainline. To see the potential for the company to use these things going forward, we need to be looking at how they're done at DCI carriers, now how they could be made to fit current bid packages.

Originally Posted by tsquare

no no no... 2200 show... 2300 go, scheduled 0100 land... (could be 0115 if the MEC buys into it....) then getting away from the airplane at... oh. let;s say... 0130. 15 minute van ride... 15 minutes to check in and find your room... = 0200 Go time is 0700, so you get picked up at 0545. But you need to shower shave and whatever... 0500 wake up. Congrats, you just got 3 hours of rest on a "scheduled" 6 hours between flights. Complete BS. Scrappy should be ashamed to present this crap.

I will not vote to trade safety for money

Originally Posted by 80ktsClamp

Looking at the DCI carriers wouldn't be appropriate as their have crazy bad work rules. We'd need to look at major level carriers that have similar restrictions and see how they are deployed there instead.

Even the way NW did them (burying them in a 5-day trip.. OUCH!) isn't relative to how they would be implemented here.

Originally Posted by tsquare

no no no... 2200 show... 2300 go, scheduled 0100 land... (could be 0115 if the MEC buys into it....) then getting away from the airplane at... oh. let;s say... 0130. 15 minute van ride... 15 minutes to check in and find your room... = 0200 Go time is 0700, so you get picked up at 0545. But you need to shower shave and whatever... 0500 wake up. Congrats, you just got 3 hours of rest on a "scheduled" 6 hours between flights. Complete BS. Scrappy should be ashamed to present this crap.

I will not vote to trade safety for money

Originally Posted by tsquare

Let me be the first to welcome you back.

Originally Posted by Whidbey

Roger. We have, however, firmly established that I shouldn't attempt math in public.

To the guys that want this to pass- where do you feel is the value in this agreement from the company's perspective?

Originally Posted by 80ktsClamp

Why would you shave again on a CDO? Are you a gorilla or something? You just shaved before the duty period begins.. the 5 o'clock shadow is the mark of the CDO titan upon returning to base in the morning!