Timbo, you gave an outstanding background explanation of why pilots would naturally hate virtual bases (especially ones senior enough to bid the trip in your example). I happily bid for trips with deadheads myself. But, it also underlines why management everywhere wants to find ways to make VBs happen. There is an awful lot of money being paid for senior guys to basically do nothing more than nap. Meanwhile, as we are all aware, this is an incredibly cutthroat business and the legacies face competitors everywhere with minimal labor costs and work rules that pale in comparison. In the long run, I don't think being consistently paid to do effectively nothing is any more tenable than the three man cockpit was. In good times we legacy pilots can get away with it, but when the next downturn hits I imagine it might be the easiest concession to swallow.

On a side note, I think Allegiant is a prime example of VBs or such taken to an extreme. I absolutely think management there does it to abrogate seniority and weaken the pilot group while maximizing shareholder returns. Definitely a cautionary model.

Disclaimer - I don't have a dog in this particular fight so please spare me any flames. I hope you guys reach a TA soon that is overwhelmingly approved.

 

There are times when the airline industry could be considered cutthroat. The duration of this contract will not be one of those times. Post-consolidation with oil where it is and will likely stay, we are printing money and handing it out to shareholders. Our domestic competitors, who are being paid significantly more than we are, spend MUCH more revenue on servicing debt - where do we see the Delta advantage for that? The arguments about Delta needing to not pay people to do "nothing" ring so hollow, it's embarrassing to even read your post. I've never been paid to do nothing, and few are paid to "consistently" do so. I have, on the other hand, been stuck on a long layover NOT being paid to do nothing other than sacrifice a day of my life away from my family that I will never get back. Dead heading is a necessary evil if network wants the flexibility to do whatever it wants with little to no notice - it's a minor cost to facility exceptional and unprecedented profitability. It's also the result of Delta not being willing to fund company moves (like in any other industry) should they decide to actually open real bases. It's a fallacy that such costs even register in the grand scheme of things. I'm not flaming - just identifying numerous ways you're carrying management's water. Save it for a DeltaNet "news" article!

 

Trading virtual basing for pay raises is short sighted. During the next downturn (it will come at some point) how easy is it for the company to force lower pay rates (negating your raise from VB) vs the pilot group negotiating away VB?
I am tired of Delta Pilots focusing on pay rates only. ITS NOT JUST ABOUT THE PAY RATES!!!

 

Virtual basing is a big hit to pilot staffing and an automatic no vote from me.

 

I think that if the company wants virtual basing the union needs to say that we need home basing. Don't want CVG to be a base, fine, the only pilot base is ATL, fine, but every pilot now can live in the city of their choosing served by delta mainline/connection and will be provided positive space on both ends of their rotation and be paid DH pay during such time.

Negotiate further in the opposite direction of their "need" to maintain QOL. But I'm just a FNG so what do I know.

 

Well if the company were losing money and about to go bankrupt, like they were when they cut my pay $100,000/yr and took $1.4 Million from my retirement plan, then I'm sure we could discuss the efficiencies and cost savings associated with virtual basing. But that's not the case today.

The DH'ng is not being paid to 'do nothing'. The pilots have to get to the airframe they are trained on. The company choses what airframes to buy, where to base them and where to fly them. Delta has the most diverse fleet of any Major airline with 10 types now and about to add two more!.

(C100+A350).

They have to train pilots in every different fleet, and then they have to get them into position to fly the trips that THEY build. All the DH'ng expense is entirely self inflicted as a result of their fleet plan. Of course they would love to jerk us around and not pay us to get into position.

They buy all these different fleets because they can get them cheap, and/or better match the airframe capacity to the markets, and they are constantly moving airframes on/off different routes.

THAT is what causes all the DH'ng, and it is a cost of doing business if you are going to operate so many different fleets.

In fact, most of us who fly a lot of the international trips that begin and end with a DH do not even use the hotels, so we are saving the company quite a bit of money on the unused hotel rooms in some of the most expensive locations, like NYC, SEA and LAX.

 

OK as a colleague and I were discussing yesterday, it was his understanding that this can be called off by either party. So we have a get out of jail free card. Why not take a look?

 

Because what the company wants it for is entirely in their favor. This is not about a MD88 pilot being able to go to work in Pensacola. It's about being rapidly able to shift widebody international flying from city to city, swap aircraft types anytime they choose without any penalty. The pilots will provide all the grease to make it work. The company eliminates lots of DH pay and the pilots get to find their own way to work instead of positive space.
The companies biggest basing struggle is always widebody international. This solves it all for them.

 

ne-go-ti-ations.

 

Yes, I asked a rep about this. It can be called off by us or the company.