Originally Posted by Raging white (Post 2193331)

Nope. Let's be accurate. The threat from DALPA was that the companies' next offer would be worse. It wasn't. It was better. They were wrong. No matter what the future holds, they got that wrong.
It's not "likely". It's fact.

Originally Posted by FL370esq (Post 2193701)

Maybe, at some point, DALPA/ALPA will fire Cohen, Weiss and Simon and hire attorneys who can actually draft contract language that defines and implements remedies for company breaches. We merely seem to react if/when the company doesn't abide by the PWA.

Take the JV breach for example. We have language in the PWA which establishes JV limits. Great. But a well-drafted contract also has provisions for the remedy if that provision is to be breached. Look at your mortgage sometime. There are a whole bunch of clauses that tell you what you can and can't do and......a whole bunch more that tell you what is going to happen if you fail to do that what you were supposed to do or did something you weren't.

I realize this will make our PWA even longer (and many don't read what we already have) but the purpose of a contract is to define what each party's obligations are under the agreement and what each party's remedies are if the other side should breach. We do a marginally adequate job on the first part...but we have done a lousy job on the second part.

Originally Posted by sailingfun (Post 2193778)

All those items have to be negotiated and then drafted. If you can't achieve them in negotiations you can't draft them.

Originally Posted by sailingfun (Post 2193767)

The current offer is not worse however with the extension to 4 years and only a 2% raise and 1% of that covered by the loss of the early raise you could argue that it is worse for the pilots. I would certainly take 1% less in pay for a 3 year deal. It's going to take at least 2% more in pay and retaining pensionability on the PS to convince me it's better.

Originally Posted by Sink r8 (Post 2193018)

Yes, yes it is.

All of our money is on Gerry and friends. Has been for a little over a year.

Frankly, they have trounced the previous group, and they have the best environment ever. SWA just dovetailed in, and tightened the market. Shouldn't be hard to get a deal in there with a Delta premium.
The MEC has been negotiating together, all through the AIP's, then they chocked in July, and disintegrated in August. I think September is it.

Originally Posted by Sink r8 (Post 2193040)

About the environment we were in. All we had was AMR going ~7% higher, with no PS.

I'm not saying that the "On-Time, On-Target" TA1 was on target, but the vote was decisive, and it gave other airlines an idea of what not to do. TA was the industry reset. Before TA1, FedEx, UPS, SWA were years into their negotiations, with not much to chow for their efforts. TA1, for all its' flaws, was an expression of the democratic process, and the beauty of that process is that it re-drew the market.

Originally Posted by Sink r8 (Post 2193243)

You are correct about the TA, wrong about who I'm "mocking". I'm just saying Gerry could try that instead of "baby needs a new pair of shoes."

I said it at the time, and I'm still saying now, that I respect the vote, and I'm glad it was so decisive. I was a reluctant but unrepentant yes on that TA, because I took RA at his word that a follow-on deal would be worse. We knew the company was overreaching, but not whether they would acknowledge it. We know they're willing to do more.

I also voted for it because I didn't trust the noreps to execute on a better deal. I will be very happy to be proven wrong. I mean that sincerely. Their success is my success, and your success.