Originally Posted by Casualinterest

Or maybe, it's simply a symbol of unity during a time we're actively trying to negotiate something for the pilot group.

Are there some entitled people? Sure. Have you ever talked to a mainline captain? Man. If you think we're being entitled over here.....

I'm sure people called us entitled when we tried to negotiate the highest pay rates in the industry. Were you one of them? Are PSA/Envoy/PDT pilots entitled for wanting to flow more? Since when is simply trying to get improvements automatically make you entitled??

For a lot of us, this is a good way for us to use the negotiating capital we've got to try and get something better. And by the way, it's entirely possible that none of the people here fighting for it will be here when it happens, we're likely fighting for the next generation of 9E pilots.

Maybe the pushback is that wearing the hat in opposition to the union campaign is essentially crossing the picket line and it makes it tougher on us to make our point. But what's funny is that I've heard more raving lividity from guys like you defending the hat than the other way. I'm glad you have a good looking uniform and look good while showing no disregard for the union you're a part of or the pilot group you work with.

I've never said one word to FO's that wear the hat, that's their choice, and I hope no one gives them too much of a hard time about it. But rather, a good discussion on the merits of the campaign. I've talked to one FO who simply misunderstood the campaign, and after we talked about it in depth he was much more on board.

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Originally Posted by pad39a

The pilot group did not vote to authorize the hats off/lanyards on campaign like the pilot group would vote to authorize a strike, so equating hat wearing with crossing a picket line is not accurate.

Originally Posted by Casualinterest

Lol i knew.....KNEW... That would be the only line from that entire post replied to. People love to ignore an entire argument because they disagree with one fragment of one sentence.
=12pt

Originally Posted by pad39a

Actually, I agreed with the rest of your post, just forgot to include that in my statement and didn’t want to go back and edit. I did not contradict anything else you said. In my opinion you are one of the competent voices of reason in these forums.



Speaking personally I think wearing the orange lanyard and leaving the hat at home is an important way to support the pilot group and I value my opportunity to do so. I also respect that there are pilots at many airlines who feel the uniform hat adds to their professional appearance. I am not aware of other pilot union campaigns which have included elements of the uniform as part of the campaign, though I do recall something about Southwest’s last contract and ties. Anyway, I am sensitive to those who want to show their support by wearing the orange lanyard and also continue to wear the hat, because I think to some the hat means more than Endeavor and Delta. Just my $0.02.

Originally Posted by pad39a

I am not aware of other pilot union campaigns which have included elements of the uniform as part of the campaign, though I do recall something about Southwest’s last contract and ties. .

Originally Posted by theUpsideDown

Long long tradition of hats off at United for hard times with management.

I know someone on here is going tell me it goes back further than United. United pilots use the uniform for all sorts of visual cues where you stand on issues. Ties with alpa pins, hats, theres some other things i feel like i should remember but i dont.

Originally Posted by pad39a

I felt like I was at least decently familiar with United’s successes; I just read a 30+ page account of the 1985 strike and don’t recall uniforms being mentioned at all, but all my information on the subject is based on reading. In my mind I have been considering pins or lanyards as accessories rather than “part of” the uniform but maybe my definition needs to expand. Perhaps a hat could fall under that category too.



These days I feel like maybe 1 in 20 UAL pilots I see is wearing a hat.

Originally Posted by Casualinterest

And Delta pilots do the lanyard thing every time they have a contract come up. I like the new ones. They're crazy bright

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