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Quote:

Originally Posted by fatsopilot (Post 1421028)

You aren't getting it, no one is for an out of seniority furlough. The ISL resulted in what is essentially the same as an out of seniority furlough (at least that is their point -- agree or disagree).

I disagree, nobody has been furloughed. My point is all the majors have different DOH merger scenarios in their past. I lost some relative seniority and I haven't stepped foot in a pinnacle airplane and hope I never do. But to want an out of seniority furlough is moronic.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mesabah (Post 1420794)

Delta management told us not to combine the list, otherwise they wouldn't pay us the cost increase of the merger and we would go bankrupt. Guess what happened.

I was on the MEC, that is not true.

Quote:

Originally Posted by fatsopilot (Post 1421028)

Based on perspective, not based on facts or the ALPA Merger and Fragmentation Policy.

Quote:

Originally Posted by fatsopilot (Post 1421028)

1. no one got furloughed
2. the bottom of the list is all colgan fo's with a few mesaba guys thrown in the mix. so any furlough wouldnt have had any pre-merger pinnacle guys anyway.

This thread has turned so pointless...

Quote:

Originally Posted by johnso29 (Post 1419344)

That's really not something to brag about. :D

LOL! So true.........

Quote:

Originally Posted by SmitteyB (Post 1421188)

I was on the MEC, that is not true.

Does being in the MEC give your story more credibility? Were you in the same MEC that said the new contract would not exert downward pressure on regional wages?

Quote:

Originally Posted by SmitteyB (Post 1421190)

Based on perspective, not based on facts or the ALPA Merger and Fragmentation Policy.

That's the whole point of this conversation, to learn from past mistakes so they aren't repeated in the future. It's to recognize ALPA merger policy is in need of overhaul because it has an adverse effect on seniority. US Airways is a great example of an ALPA merger policy F up.

Here's an example, lets say I get a bank stupid enough to loan me enough money to buy 50 A380's. A business plan doomed to fail. Yet, I hire 1000 pilots with DOH 2013. Two years later my company is on the verge of bankruptcy, and if Delta acquires me, the basically get a deal on all those brand new aircraft. You think it's perfectly okay that all my pilots get to go ahead of the Delta pilots, simply because the A380 is bigger than anything DAL has? It's complete nonsense.

Quote:

Originally Posted by fatsopilot (Post 1421283)

Does being in the MEC give your story more credibility? Were you in the same MEC that said the new contract would not exert downward pressure on regional wages?

I wasn't a voting member for the Concessionary Agreement, but I was for the JCBA and The Bloch Award.

So yes, I am more credible than an "I heard this" perspective.

And yes absolutely the Concessionary Agreement 2013 does put downward pressure on the industry. But so does the next GoJet regional startup.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mesabah (Post 1421295)

The ALPA Merger and Fragmentation Policy was revised after the Nicolau Award. It's offspring is what the Bloch Award was bound by.

You're suggesting it is still flawed, correct?

Your example is ridiculous. Why would size of aircraft matter in an arbitrated SLI? Career expectations, DOH, and relative seniority all are good barometers for a seniority list merger.

The bottom line is there is never going to be a perfect way to do combine lists. Someone will always be upset.