"Captain Add List" - WTF?
04-05-2018, 04:35 PM
#51
Line Holder
Joined APC: Jan 2018
Posts: 30
Why don’t you call your ALPA rep and find out. How do you know they are not?
Step by step people. Evidence gathering is needed. You don’t go to the FAA with complains. You go with evidence (not just a couple HI6 messages).
Follow the Guidelines, and call your rep with questions. This applies to FOs as well.
Re-read the FASTREAD a few times. Well written, with purpose.
Step by step people. Evidence gathering is needed. You don’t go to the FAA with complains. You go with evidence (not just a couple HI6 messages).
Follow the Guidelines, and call your rep with questions. This applies to FOs as well.
Re-read the FASTREAD a few times. Well written, with purpose.
If you think all of this is about a couple of HI6 messages you are mistaken. The facts are, there is still a list tracking captain add fuel and that list is used by the company to coerce captains into not adding fuel.
Even if they don't call us into the chief pilot's office, it can still silently, cause a personnel ding in your file. Try flowing through with that.
04-05-2018, 04:44 PM
#52
Line Holder
Joined APC: Jan 2018
Posts: 25
Here's a down-n-dirty back of the envelope calculation of the cost of carrying extra fuel on the 175 interpolated from some Jeppesen data and a few wild ass guesses:
*This is not thoroughly scienced out, verified, vetted or otherwise reliable, but it provides some frame of reference. Lots of room for different approaches or interpretations. Do not use for flight planning
*This is not thoroughly scienced out, verified, vetted or otherwise reliable, but it provides some frame of reference. Lots of room for different approaches or interpretations. Do not use for flight planning
04-05-2018, 05:21 PM
#53
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Dec 2015
Posts: 687
This has nothing to do with the survey. No one would have complained that we take too much fuel. That was purely management. I hope everyone mentioned our horrible ramp crews (some are great!). We do the work trying to minimize delays only for someone to ruin that at either end by not going a ****. They have zero initiative and I frankly don’t blame them. I just hope that it’s addressed. Nothing like watching your commute close up because you waited 5 minutes for ramp crews sitting on their asses.
04-05-2018, 05:43 PM
#54
On Reserve
Joined APC: Feb 2017
Posts: 20
This has nothing to do with the survey. No one would have complained that we take too much fuel. That was purely management. I hope everyone mentioned our horrible ramp crews (some are great!). We do the work trying to minimize delays only for someone to ruin that at either end by not going a ****. They have zero initiative and I frankly don’t blame them. I just hope that it’s addressed. Nothing like watching your commute close up because you waited 5 minutes for ramp crews sitting on their asses.
04-05-2018, 06:06 PM
#55
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2017
Posts: 147
I feel like the CRJ manager was told to make everyone more conservative when using CA ADD, but blew it way out of porportion. No way a pilot would ever so strongly advise the PIC to not act in a way that ensures safety.
04-05-2018, 06:12 PM
#56
Line Holder
Joined APC: Jan 2013
Posts: 49
I’m pretty sure THAT is a legit e-mail. If so, he is brave to send it. That being said, on the 145, I have had very little to no pushback requesting gas for various reasons. I have personally had Captains coach me that if your arrival gas is less than __, than you need to request add fuel, which is just ignorant. As a Captain, you should be able to read a little deeper into the situation before asking for gas “Just because”. If you are short on you flight plan you need to be proactive, and let the dispatch and SOC know something is not adding up. Unfortunately making the determination on gas, requires some experience which many folks at Envoy are lacking. Regardless, let’s teach these Captains and not threaten them. If they can’t be taught, then maybe they should be dealt with.
04-05-2018, 06:49 PM
#57
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2017
Posts: 263
Here's a down-n-dirty back of the envelope calculation of the cost of carrying extra fuel on the 175 interpolated from some Jeppesen data and a few wild ass guesses:
*This is not thoroughly scienced out, verified, vetted or otherwise reliable, but it provides some frame of reference. Lots of room for different approaches or interpretations. Do not use for flight planning
*This is not thoroughly scienced out, verified, vetted or otherwise reliable, but it provides some frame of reference. Lots of room for different approaches or interpretations. Do not use for flight planning
04-05-2018, 07:25 PM
#58
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jan 2013
Posts: 294
So apparently it's ok to ferry 8K lbs of fuel from a cheaper airport, weight restrict the flight, and boot 2 paying passengers on a booked full fight, the last flight of the night. But God forbid I ask for 500 lbs CA ADD on a different flight. Got it...
FWIW, I don't think the ord fleet manager did this on his own. That influence and pressure had to come from somewhere higher up. I think maybe he dove on to the grenade, and in turn brought this management fuel naziing into full light.
FWIW, I don't think the ord fleet manager did this on his own. That influence and pressure had to come from somewhere higher up. I think maybe he dove on to the grenade, and in turn brought this management fuel naziing into full light.
04-05-2018, 07:51 PM
#60
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2016
Posts: 2,482
So apparently it's ok to ferry 8K lbs of fuel from a cheaper airport, weight restrict the flight, and boot 2 paying passengers on a booked full fight, the last flight of the night. But God forbid I ask for 500 lbs CA ADD on a different flight. Got it...
FWIW, I don't think the ord fleet manager did this on his own. That influence and pressure had to come from somewhere higher up. I think maybe he dove on to the grenade, and in turn brought this management fuel naziing into full light.
FWIW, I don't think the ord fleet manager did this on his own. That influence and pressure had to come from somewhere higher up. I think maybe he dove on to the grenade, and in turn brought this management fuel naziing into full light.
BTW, for those that don't know, once it's determined that the flight is weight restricted, ops will not approve a jumpseater for any reason. Even if it can be determined later that weight will allow it. It takes a strong willed captain to make it happen at that point.
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