Airline Pilot Central Forums

Airline Pilot Central Forums (https://www.airlinepilotforums.com/)

- Envoy Airlines (https://www.airlinepilotforums.com/envoy-airlines/)

- - Sam Pool Email (https://www.airlinepilotforums.com/envoy-airlines/113524-sam-pool-email.html)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jetunderwing (Post 2589533)

With being here 2 years and seeing double the seniority behind me, it is interesting the Protected Pilots are getting so much at the expense of over half the pilots on the roster. I realize a lot of the MEC is about to flow and about time to clear the cobwebs but with well over half the list here less than 2 years i dont want to hear about the protected pilots 8 years on reserve or any other violins they wanna play. I want pay and qol, irregardless of them and the contract they all voted in thats a complete joke.

Cool story, bro...; "Before start checklist...!"

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pedro4President (Post 2589690)

For all those FOs that think the flow is UNFAIR how about we make it fair. How about you flow at the same length of time the PP pilots flow? Is it fair that you flow in 5.5-7 years when they flowed in 8-12 years?? Perspective people.

Yeah FOs lets make our flow 8-12 years so that we can make everything nice and FAIR for everyone. Since PP had it bad why don’t we make it bad for the rest, thats fair right?
and you want to talk about perspective? Dude... You should stick with the, there are winners and losers rant.

So tired of the argument that I’m supposed to be ok with being crapped on just because someone else was crapped on long before me. 12 year flow all around would be fair? Guess what, if the outlook of the industry was similar to when you decided to stick it out at Eagle, then I would never have chosen this career. The 5 year flow is the only reason I’m an airline pilot. I would have taken a different line of work if retirements weren’t going through the roof, but somehow I’m supposed to pay reparations for what someone else’s generation did at this company like I had a say. Like telling women to stop complaining about sexual harassment because at least they get to vote. Stop living in the past and try to make this a better job while the times are conducive to gains.

Quote:

Originally Posted by mketch11 (Post 2589739)

Your flow time just increased by 3-5 months. Do you not see that??

Quote:

Originally Posted by griff312 (Post 2589723)

Cool story, bro...; "Before start checklist...!"

You win the Internet for the day! :D

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pedro4President (Post 2589745)

Your flow time just increased by 3-5 months. Do you not see that??

I saw 3-4, and I’m not sure it’s a gain if it’s correcting a flow violation, it should have been that way already. More of a Nuetral outcome on that minus the guys who already left who were hosed.

Quote:

Originally Posted by mketch11 (Post 2589748)

Everyone saw and read three to four months, but the reality is three to five months.

My flow date moved up 4 and possibly 5 months.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pedro4President (Post 2589745)

Your flow time just increased by 3-5 months. Do you not see that??

Please show your math working based on the LOA how your flow just increased. Are you sure you didn’t mean decrease by 3-5 months?

Quote:

Originally Posted by BIueSideUp (Post 2589705)

This is something that might soon be forgotten. I sat next to a guy last week that will be going to AA after 12+ years. All things staying the same, I'll be in his position in 4 years from today or at Delta in even less if that works out. That's totally unfair to the guys going now, but it's also the nature of the game.

Any FO that feels they aren't getting what they're entitled to is a Generation Z toddler that needs to take a hard look at how well-set they are to make an amazing career happen (and read up on some industry history). I would definitely consider these recent improvements a win. They weren't intended to benefit the FO group, but many FOs will benefit from them soon enough when they take a CA vacancy and get the immediate pay raise and when getting sent to LGA (if they even have to) becomes much more reasonable with the hotels and positive space to/from.

This is good news, which is better than bad news.

While I generally feel this was a positive for the PP’s and soon to upgrade FO’s I must admit I hate the argument of “well I went through hell so you should be grateful you didn’t and just shut the hell up”. This is a thinly veiled excuse for you choosing to stay in an environment that wasn’t friendly to you. I would not be here right now if the advertised flow was 8 years, plain and simple. I switched careers to come to this for the very fact the time to majors was supposed to come way down.

Anyway, I appreciate that you stuck it out, I wouldn’t have that’s for sure, but please don’t project your frustration for having to do it on those that are fighting for the betterment of all the pilots.

Remember it’s also the low time guys, older guys switching careers and the people that didn’t slug it out through the crap that are pushing you up and out of here.

Much respect all around and hopefully this isn’t taken personally.

Is the ALPA flow sheet updated?