Originally Posted by badtransam97 (Post 1965257)

I understand. I have been to one interview, and would like to interview possibly with Envoy, or a few more. If in fact the best QOL and schedules at Envoy will be on the 170, I dont want to interview and be offered a class, then have to say well, do I take it or try to put it off in hopes of getting the 170..I meet the mins to these companies, so Im trying to not shotgun them to everyone, and be a little more specific to whom I apply with.

Originally Posted by badtransam97 (Post 1965221)

Yeah Im hoping for the e-175 because Ive heard QOL would be better because the current guys can't bid it. So Im trying to time when I send my app in..

Originally Posted by badtransam97 (Post 1965257)

I understand. I have been to one interview, and would like to interview possibly with Envoy, or a few more. If in fact the best QOL and schedules at Envoy will be on the 170, I dont want to interview and be offered a class, then have to say well, do I take it or try to put it off in hopes of getting the 170..I meet the mins to these companies, so Im trying to not shotgun them to everyone, and be a little more specific to whom I apply with.

Originally Posted by eaglefly (Post 1964819)

It appears the last of the 824 won't flow until sometime in 2017. A lot of variables there. If you get hired at Envoy next year, expecting a 6 year ride to AA as per recent claims isn't realistic. If AAG consolidates some or all of its wholly-owned's, it gets worse and you'll have thousands of pilots ahead of you for AA and combined with almost certainly a slower monthly metric, that's a long wait.

IMO, the guys SELLING this now all have self-serving motives. They don't give a rats patoot about any newbie, they want Envoy to be as robust as possible just long enough to get their own tickets punched to AA, that's all.

A lot of Envoy Pinocchio's running around there (and here) these days. :cool:

Caveat Emptor.

Originally Posted by griff312 (Post 1965387)

Like the others said, apply and interview. Don't wait around, get the job offer first, and then make your decision as to where to go. You'll be better off that way, than if you drag your feet applying / interviewing, and then realizing that it's too late, or you "missed the bus", so to speak. As Pagey said, the interviewers might be able to answer the current equipment classes being filled better than we can.

As for DAL to DFW, you can take the Light Rail from one airport to the other, but I think it adds just over an hour + to the commute. But it's available if you run out of options getting in to DFW. These are all things you can sort out once you get the job offer, but for now, GET THE JOB OFFER! LOL.

As for bidding the 175, it's a crap shoot. No one knows yet what the schedules will be like. But if historics are an indicator, they will probably suck for the first year, while they try and sort out its rightful place in the system "growing pains for a new fleet type". It was the same way when we brought the new CRJ's online, only half a dozen to a dozen routes flown out of DFW over and over. Then they moved them to LGA & ORD, and closed the CRJ DFW base, although we still do through flying on them from ORD. Right now, 175 FO went VERY senior, because senior FO's in NY and MIA expecting to upgrade before being displaced, so they didn't have current equipment in their displacement bid. So they got the upgrade, then simultaneously got displaced back to FO a few seconds later, since there was nothing in their displacement bid, so they got displaced to what was needed, which was the 175. Very few FO's actually asked for it. As an FO, you cannot bid from jet to jet. You can only be displaced from one jet to another. Having said that, either the 145 or CRJ could have you displaced any time, of you're junior, so there's a chance you could still displaced to the 175, if it's in your displacement bid. Also, most of the senior FO's that got displaced into the 175 are now upgrading, so a new hire vacancy for it is still a 50/50 scenario.

I'll try to call you tomorrow when I get to work.

Originally Posted by eaglefly (Post 1964819)

IMO, the guys SELLING this now all have self-serving motives. They don't give a rats patoot about any newbie, they want Envoy to be as robust as possible just long enough to get their own tickets punched to AA, that's all.

Originally Posted by FlameNSky (Post 1966156)

I was wondering how long it would take you to make that little claim. How many envoy pilots have you heard advocating the company during the last 3 years? I had repeatedly steered many prospective new hire away from envoy due to the current management practices. Even with the Director of Flight Ops claimed that envoy would
have a 2 1/2 year upgrade and 6 year
flow, I along with many envoy pilots didn't believe him. Not until they disclosed their plan did I show any confidence in their flow plan. Yes, just like any "plan" there are multiple variables that must happen. That same predicament is true of all regionals right now. Do you think a new hire at RAH has any good prospects if no one else comes to join the company? What is going to happen at Mesa, PSA, TSA, AWA if the new hires stop coming? What we are going to see going forward is a battle of incentives to new pilots. Endeavor is offering $20,000, envoy is offering flow (Compass is offering nothing btw) It is going to be a competition among the companies as to what incentive will work. Personally, I think envoy will eventually have to offer the flow and pay. But when that time comes, it will be a whole lot easier for envoy to add increased pay to its incentives than it will be for United or Delta to set up an flow program. Just as those who when to PSA before they double in size benefited from the expansion, I think those who get on with envoy before 300 guys flow next year will benefit. And the incentives are just beginning.


Motives. You clearly have an ulterior motive toward envoy. Maybe a little bitter. Maybe a little regret about your decision to leave and you can't bare to see things work out. I am part of the 824. I will flow over to AA (if I do not get hired by United or Delta first) within the next 12 - 18 months, regardless of whether or not the new hires come. If they come, I still leave while envoy's flow works as advertised and envoy becomes to way to get to AA. If they don't come, I still flow as envoy shrinks. Either way, I still flow as dictated by Nicolau's ruling. Nothing will change that. I literally have no skin in the game. I only endorse envoy because I truly do believe that Parker wants to use the flow as a way to staff his regional flying without increasing pay. As has already been seen, as the other carriers cannot staff the flying, it is coming back to envoy. As more guys flow, more flying comes to envoy it will mean better opportunity for new hires.