Envoy or PDT
 

I already have a class date for Envoy, however i've been following the Envoy information thread and I can't get over the fact that everybody complains about their horrible QOL. I am really hoping it will get better with the increase of pilots being hired.

However I would like to find out a bit more about the other WO, there is already a thread comparing PSA to Envoy. But how does Envoy compare to PDT?

Most everyone is expecting scheduling/QOL to get better.

175 is a new fleet and growing. EVERYONE knows the QOL on a new fleet is terrible. But, it is a growing fleet so the QOL should increase as more planes come on property.

145 DFW is getting back the flying from express jet in 2017 and we are optimistic the scheduling issues will get fixed.

145 ORD I don't know much about.

Crj700. Well most people expect them to be gone in 2017.

😪😴😪😴😪😴😪😴😪😴😪😴😪😪

Thanks I really hope it gets better.

I think the 700s will resume transfer in 2017, but won't be completed until late 2018 or possibly 2019. Like most airlines, our attrition is high and we will have to consistently fill classes well into 2017 to make the transfer of the remain 30-something a reality. I'm not saying it won't happen, only that there are still hurdles.

What is high attrition for PSA? Envoy has been loosing about 10-15 per month outside the flow. 2-1 FO-CA ratio

So far this month (since Nov 8th), we have lost 14 at PSA. It was over 25 a month outside of the flow for the last couple months.

We are losing a ton of pilots to the LCC's and majors. Delta has been hiring more than are flowing to AA.

PSA hired a hundreds of experienced pilots in 2014 and 2015, with 8-10 years of airline experience. They upgraded immediately and now have a year or more as Captain. Now, they are all leaving and moving on to bigger and better things.

We have even lost FO's to Delta, Southwest, JetBlue, and United in the last couple months alone.

This is just the tip.. just the tip

Seriously. Imagine summer 2018. It will be bedlam.

That's what I told her !! 😆😅😄😃😂😁😀😆😅

I thought she said, is that just the tip? And you said, "uh no that's the whole thing." :p

[QUOTE=chrisreedrules;2248656]I think the 700s will resume transfer in 2017, but won't be completed until late 2018 or possibly 2019. Like most airlines, our attrition is high and we will have to consistently fill classes well into 2017 to make the transfer of the remain 30-something a reality. I'm not saying it won't happen, only that there are still hurdles.[/QUOTE

Summer flying is going to be nuts at PDT. We just got the 12th 145 this month.. 13th in December that we start taking accelerating the jet deliveries..

We are 6 months away till I gets crazy again.. I'm interested to see what will happen..

Ha ! Good one.Gotta laugh at that .😆😅😄😂😁

[QUOTE=MKUltra;2249165]I'm curious to see if we will hit DEC on the jet after almost half the company opted in to the Dash incentive Program and cannot bid the jet in a vacancy. The one displacement we had didn't end up displacing anyone and jet captain spots continue to be offered. I guess it all depends on how many FOs are eligible to bid (and want) a 145 Captain seat.

Summer will certainly be interesting, that's for sure.

So I am still trying to decide where to go tell me if this is correct:


Piedmont:

Pro's
Faster Upgrade 12 - 15 months according to their website
Chance to earn more $$$ by flying extra when possible.
Faster upgrade also means more $$$ sooner
Very short reserve times

Con's
Philadelphia is their only base for the 145. I don't want to commute so I would have to move there and I am not a big fan of Phili.
Bonus is only $16200

Envoy
Pro's
Better bases (I wouldn't mind living on ORD or DFW)
Bonus is $22000

Con's
Long reserve times
Longer upgrade (2.5 years according to Envoy's website)
Horrible schedule (according to the Envoy thread)

[QUOTE=Wink;2249174]Your not kidding.. In the meantime I'm going to enjoy my extra money. I doubt there will be dec now that we have many fos with the required time. That being said the jet training program is going to clogged with new hires right now and the jet is desperately short on fos. We're fat fos on the dash right now. Short on captains on both..

There will be large displacements once mdt and SBY close.. Plenty of time to take voluntary and involuntary type moves, along with seat moves.

Plenty of open time at envoy if you want to work more for 200%

Are you sure our bonuses are different? I'm not very well versed on how much it is or how its paid, but I thought PDT/PSA/ENY had the same bonus structure for new hires.

envoy
$37,900 base pay + $17,100 signing bonus + $5,000 (if you fly CRJ or E145) = $60,000

PSA
$38,480 base pay + $16,520 signing + $5,000 (if you have CRJ type rating) = $60,000

Piedmont
$38,800 base pay + $16,200 signing + $5,000 (if you have any Part 121 experience) = $60,000

It is still a b scale and should not be tolerated.

Tell that to the mainline geezers who sold scope for pay.

I'm sure the 2.5 upgrade is a projection for someone hired now, but what is the current most junior captain at?

Never mind saw it on APC. 5 years

Piedmont awarded ERJ145 captain to July 2016 new hire.

In old envoy planes! Funny.

Actually, we just got an email that Piedmont is getting 175's

Envoy upgrade is 6+ yrs, horrible would imply something good about our schedules, horrible seems to nice.

Post the email

Not anytime soon

PDT will never get 175s. Why would AAG waste millions of dollars a month on training, maintenance, management, and other costs? AAG is wisely moving flying around based on fleet type to reduce costs and be more efficient. In the end, PSA will fly the CRJs, Envoy will fly the EJets, and PDT will fly the 145's.

Once the fuel prices rise again and the market tanks, the 50 seaters will find themselves parked in the desert somewhere.

Right now it is 6 years at Envoy but with 60 to 70 NH a month and 30 Capt leaving a month that number should drop drastically. We are at the beginning of going from stagnation to steady movement. In 6 months to a year, if it is still 6 years upgrade we are in trouble. Common sense says that's not possible for it to stay 6 years as long as we keep hiring pilots and pilots keep flowing to AA.

Your sarcasm detector seems to be INOP.

They won't waste a damn dollar Just merge PDT with us and there you have it.

A friend interviewed at PDT recently.They told him the original plan for PDT was 175 s but the faa wouldn't sign off on it .They wanted to see them successfully operate a smaller jet first rather than jumping from the dash to a 76 Seat jet.
They will eventually get 175s as the 145s time out I'm sure

But people are actually believing it and sharing it.

There is no way. PDT will be merged or simply cease to exist long before they ever get 175's.

Piedmont is in an excellent place geographically for AA. When the 145s time out, it wouldn't surprise me at all to see them replaced with 175s.

2011 has a lotttt of hires. it would be hard to get through them all in 6months. after they are all upgraded though yes upgrade will plummet

2011 NH= 272
2012 NH= 6
2013 NH= 70
2014 NH= 59
2015 NH= 93
2016 NH= 300 +
2017 NH = 600 + at same hire rate now
2017 AA FLOW 360 to 400


You are correct that is good news. Esp if we get more 175's and open more bases. Also not including any attrition to other legacy or LLC's

LOL...Keep dreaming..Dallas CEO magazine 12/1/16 said Fábregas, when asked what’s ahead for Envoy. “These 76-seat planes are the future of our regional network.”

Yeah, the 175 is the future for Envoy. Clearly, the only logical conclusion to draw is that no other WO regional will get 76 seat jets

daOldMan strikes again!!

Makes total sense to grow a company in a huge way and then shut the doors. blah blah blah

What world do you live in man??