F224

WallyF4's has written a great piece. I lived through the NWA hiring disaster brought upon us there by a Phd. Private Pilot he spoke of. Part of the reason that the majors are reluctant to hire any reservist right now is the very fact that they may be deployed or on long term military leave. That has nothing to do with training issues and everything to do with avoiding the cost of training an employee who might be gone for months, or years on end.

Sluggo_63

And is EXTREMELY illegal. Also, extremely hard to prove...

Adlerdriver

I have to disagree with you on this point for the simple fact that he's basing much of his comments on incorrect information.

FedEx does include pilots in the hiring process.
HR is, in fact, not included in the actual interview process.
We are still hiring top notch candidates.

Other than that, he's spot on.

This may be the situation and if so, it's very unfortunate. Perhaps a situation brought on by the actions of a minority of past guardsmen and reservists. While the choice to avoid such candidates on the part of FedEx is unfortunate, it is their prerogative.

However, it's not a result of their failing to "value the experience and competency" of military pilots in general - as the OP lamented. Somehow we still manage to have a pretty high percentage of former military in our new hire classes - but let's not let the facts cloud the issue.

He has complaints about the PE program - so do I.
Complaints about the general selection process and computer screening algorithm? So do I - I can't get a civilian buddy to even be considered because his time is too high.

Maybe he should have done a bit more research and written about what is actually happening here instead of trying to make his narrative fit whatever happened almost 30 years ago at NWA. Because in the cold light of the day, it's not, no matter how eloquently and passionately our proud captain tried to convince us it is.

The end result of his Op-Ed (in three different threads) was to end up generating random comments that may or may not be related or truly factual from those with both military and civilian backgrounds. After that, in this thread anyway, it's pretty much devolved into a bit of a pi$$ing contest which we really don't need. Reading this thread, you'd think FedEx had big issues with mixing folks of various backgrounds. Out on the line, I see mutual respect and rarely, if ever, encounter issues with someone's former life, whatever that may be.

Time to move on and maybe chalk this one up to a senior moment.

Adlerdriver

Are you sure about this? I know it's illegal to discriminate against guard/reserve employees because of their military service obligations. Does the law really extend into the choice to actually hire someone or not hire someone? I'm not arguing, truly asking.

DiamondZ

Over the past 10 years that's exactly what has happened. But then again Im sure its a coincidence.

Boeingornotgoin

I have been at FedEx for a while, but am new to this APC thing. My very first post was earlier in this thread trying to put some actual numbers to the assertion made by the author of this Op-Ed message. Emotions are great and all, but facts tell the true story.

My earlier post:

FedEx has had a good reputation for hiring military veterans in the past. No issue. Also, I have no interest in starting some contest with the valuable members of the FedEx team with pure civilian backgrounds. We are one team. However, I will add one data point to the discussion: There have been about 40 guys from my previous military community consistently applying to FedEx over the past five years. Folks enter and exit that list, but the number stays at about 40. In 2016, FedEx hired 18 of these folks. In 2017, FedEx only hired 3. That's an 84% decrease in this small sample - significant. In each year, FedEx hired approx 400 total new hires. Meanwhile 28 members of this list were hired by Delta and American, etc in 2017. They were very motivated to come to FedEx (first choice), but that call never came. The applicants from my former community are exceptional aviators with great leadership backgrounds...Wing Commanders, instructors, evaluators, test experience, etc. Most have a PE. Some have 2 PE's. Most are retiring, with no guard or reserve concerns. I have received several e-mails and calls asking, "What's up with HR at FedEx?" I have no answers for them, but something is up. From my admittedly small sample size, there does seem to be a poor trend developing lately.

I have asked the boss at Emerald Coast Interview Consulting (ECIC) to have his team do some math and see if the issue I raise on my small sample size is quantifiable on a larger scale, displaying a new anti-veteran bias at FedEx. His folks are still compiling numbers, but here is their initial look. BTW, the individual doing the math has a pure civilian background.

1. First, yes...DAL and AA each have approx 14,500 pilots on the roster, while we have appox 4,700. So they are bigger and are probably going to win the hiring numbers battle every day and twice on Sunday. However, the desired 2018 hiring goals for the majors are: DAL - 900, AA - 900, UA - 700, SWA - 900, FedEx - 500, UPS - 300. We are competing for the same product (both mil and civ qualified applicants). The pool of available candidates is shrinking fast. Supposedly, aviation globally needs approx 40,000 new-hires in the next ten years. Does anybody think there are 40,000 qualified applicants out there today?
How should one act when in a fight for an ever-shrinking vital commodity? DAL and AA are calling, yes actually calling folks (as in on the phone) early. They are interviewing early, often, and quickly (90 - 120 days prior to avail date). They are offering same day CJO'S. Have you seen the letter new-hires get from FedEx HR? I have had guys call me asking if the lawyer gobledygook on the e-mail actually means they are hired or not. Answer - It does not...until a second vague e-mail arrives a few weeks later. Lawyers! When KD called me years ago, she told me that the "Your hired" calls were the best part of her job. I wonder how she feels about this lawyered-up approach? Just me, but cold impersonal legalized approaches do not win personnel wars, and we are in a war. According to the rep at ECIC, even our most direct competitor UPS is adjusting:

"UPS has significantly altered the technique for hiring in the last few months. Previously, they selected a majority of civilian candidates to interview, but now it appears they have jumped in and are interviewing many military pilots AND offering them a job offer and class date within just a few days after the interview. Quite a few military candidates I work with place a priority on FDX or UPS. If UPS is offering them a spot first, many of those are choosing to stick with Big Brown and pass on FDX."

2. Yes, FedEx hired a very good share of military aviators in the past. However, according to ECIC's initial hack, from Aug 2017 until Jan 2018, there were 102 candidates. 34 (33%) were military and 68 (67%) were civilian, right at 1/3 to 2/3rd ratio. More math to do on the historic numbers that will take a few days. I will report back.

Is there an anti-military bias at FedEx? Yet TBD. However, it seems clear that:

A. The numbers are down.
B. We, at a minimum, are not optimizing our approach to acquire these folks. FedEx is the last one to vote by waiting to 30 days out to interview. Not a method to get the best of the best pilots, either civilian or military. That much seems clear to even me.

3. Not a numbers thing, but just a POV. Either flying for FedEx is a profession or it's just a job. Why are things professions? I would argue because lives are at stake. Medicine, law, military aviation, civilian aviation - all professions. A surgeon could make a mistake and kill a person on an operating table (one person at one time), so we all agree we want professionals cutting on us. An attorney could send the wrong person to his lethal injection (one person over about a five year period), so we want professionals there too. Military pilots drop weapons in tight spaces - how 'bout we have professionals do that. How many lives could a Delta 777 Capt affect if he made a mistake on short final? Hundreds. I would argue, that aviators have the most cause to act like professionals. Well how do these "professions" grow the next generation of professionals? Doctors completely control the input of doctors. They own the process, start to finish. Law? Lawyers control the input of lawyers. So you want to be a partner at the Dowee, Cheetum, and How Law Firm. Guess who you are going to have to go through? Mil aviation - You want to fly F/A-18's, F-16's, C-130's, B-52's, etc, etc, guess who gets to decide if you join the team? Getting your wings and building hours in the civilian world is the same. CFIIs own it. So, why exactly have we at FedEx farmed out much of the process to a Dr of Psychology and some legal folks, exactly? How many hours do they have avoiding thunderstorms and doing XW landings exactly? Imagine Dr H having to pass a board of pilots who have veto power over him getting his doctorate. Silly, I agree, pilot don't know crap about psychology...but just as silly as him voting on our aviation profession, of which he is not a remote part. The much referred to "Old School Brother-in-law act" of sponsorship was not that at all...at all, at all!! It was professional FedEx pilots doing their professional responsibility to grow the next generation of professionals, recommending skilled folks to take over when we leave, nothing more, nothing less. Any thing else is...wait for it...unprofessional.

Both military and civilian aviators want to bring the best talent to the team. This is not a mil vs civilian thing. It is a pilot vs legal thing. It is a decision to act like professionals, or to abdicate that responsibility. Having pilots on the interview team is outstanding, but if there is no ability to affect the list of interviewees and we act last in the industry, you get what's left over after DAL and AA have picked their teams. Not a great plan for success. Just my longwinded 2 cents.

fr8doggiestyle

CAT III Autoland, FAR duty limits, NADP departures, International Ops, Metering at a Class B airport, approaches to an untowered field, ACARS, dispatch, operational control, Exemption 3585, bidding, jumpseating, and landing an aircraft without tower checking to make sure the gear is down.

Is that a more acceptable list, Cap?

Sliceback

AA’s military percentage in 2017 was 35%.

DL’s in 2016 was 47%.

UA in 2015 was 37%.

FedEx hiring 33% between August 2017 - Jan 2018 might be a big fat meh.

Sluggo_63

It is not their prerogative to not hire military personnel based on their military service.

Yes it does. USERRA is very clear about this point.

USERRA 1002.40

Boeingornotgoin

Sliceback, that certainly could be valid. Still crunching numbers over a wider date range. However amongst my buds, 18 hired in 2016 vs 3 in 2017, with 28 lost to the competitors are real numbers. At a minimum that presents an impression and raises the question. More math to do. Well see if the macro numbers point to an actual issue or not. I really think the main issue is timing. As they say, "Timing is everything." Factually, we are picking players for our team last. We are probably missing talent in both the civ and mil worlds. I do not view that as a good thing.