Widebody vs 757 Capt
06-01-2018, 02:26 PM
#21
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Aug 2012
Posts: 711
Originally Posted by rvfanatic
So this is confirmed? 757 CA pay as 777 FO? What’s the average annual pay for 777 FOs?
I’m always learning but looking at the pay rate I noticed 215/hr 15yr 777FO and 262/hr 15yr 757 CA so wondering how the 47/hr difference is made up. Does one sacrifice QOL To make up the difference?
I’m always learning but looking at the pay rate I noticed 215/hr 15yr 777FO and 262/hr 15yr 757 CA so wondering how the 47/hr difference is made up. Does one sacrifice QOL To make up the difference?
I absolutely believe a senior 777 F/O and a slightly more senior MD-11 F/O can earn more than a 757 Captain who is just flying his line. Yes, the F/Os may have a couple more calendar days in their schedule, but I bet the number of days away from home is very similar between the 757 Captain and the wide body F/O. Plus, the company is much more civilized internationally. The hotels are generally very nice, catering is better, schedules less fatiguing than a week of hub turns (although you do have the circadian fatigue that can make it harder). This all being said, many people thrive on the international schedule with long legs and many can't stand it. Also, many domestic guys can get home town DHs and such.
What makes this job particularly nice, is you're only forced to be junior once. From then on, it's your choice what works best for you. There are so many different combinations of types of flying that almost everyone finds a niche where they park for awhile.
06-01-2018, 04:59 PM
#22
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jul 2016
Posts: 463
Originally Posted by kc10/c130
I couldn't afford the pay cut to go to 757 Capt. Inside of top 50% in the seat and high 5 is no problem. Only issue is what to do with getting Diamond/Platinum status on whatever airline you fly 
. The big BUT is if you can't sleep on the plane. Otherwise, no brainier. The QOL question I don't understand. You work less and get paid more, not to mention the occasional bump.
. The big BUT is if you can't sleep on the plane. Otherwise, no brainier. The QOL question I don't understand. You work less and get paid more, not to mention the occasional bump.
06-01-2018, 05:05 PM
#23
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Aug 2012
Posts: 711
Originally Posted by C130driver
Aren’t you guaranteed business class for INTL deadheads? Honest question just curious.
06-01-2018, 05:33 PM
#24
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2013
Posts: 2,756
Originally Posted by Raptor
For origin and destination outside the 48 contiguous states, the flight must be over 2+30 to be in business. Other flights have to be over 5+30 to qualify for higher class of service.
06-01-2018, 05:35 PM
#25
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jul 2007
Position: 767 Captain
Posts: 3,988
Originally Posted by rvfanatic
So this is confirmed? 757 CA pay as 777 FO? What’s the average annual pay for 777 FOs?
I’m always learning but looking at the pay rate I noticed 215/hr 15yr 777FO and 262/hr 15yr 757 CA so wondering how the 47/hr difference is made up. Does one sacrifice QOL To make up the difference?
I’m always learning but looking at the pay rate I noticed 215/hr 15yr 777FO and 262/hr 15yr 757 CA so wondering how the 47/hr difference is made up. Does one sacrifice QOL To make up the difference?
Raptor hit on a few factors, but the bottom line on this really comes down to credit hours per day of work. Doing a little bid pack kung fu using your favorite bidding software will make most of this readily evident. I'm certainly not interested in convincing someone senior to me that 777 FO is the place to be, but it's really not that difficult to figure out. There is way, way more to this than simply looking at pay rates.
June bidpacks for both seats:
Max days off lines on the 757 (17 days off) pay 68.1 CH or 6.2 CH per day. 3 international Trips. Comprised of 2 leg and 3 leg duty periods. You get 3 round trip commutes to do that (unless you want to kill the 2 dead days between trips in MEM) while flying 12 revenue flights that month.
Max days off line on the 777 (20 days off) pay 69.2 CH or 8.65 CH per day.
2 Trips as an RFO. Both two 2-day front deadheads to HKG, so two "half-commutes" on the back-end of each trip with a paid two day commute to start. One 15.5 hour revenue flight back to MEM each trip for a total of 2 revenue legs that month.
Do the math on those two lines and the 757 CA makes more that month. BUT - a very important BUT - he works 3-extra days to make those additional dollars.
Since the 25% 777 FO can consistently hold carryover, he can choose to plus up his month using a 3-day trip and work the same number of days as the 757 CA above. I'll be conservative and say those 3 extra days pay 6.4 (trip rig) per day. So now - working the same number of days as his 757 CA buddy, he earns 88.4 CH of pay for the month (averaging just over 8 CH of pay per day).
777 FO: $215/hour + $8/hour x 88.4 = $19,713 for the month
757 CA: $262/hour + $10/hour x 69.1 = $18,795 for the month
Pick a more middle of the road scenario: Find some lines with 16 days off each.
A nice two trip month on the 757 both with double deadheads:
68.5 CH of pay for the month (5.7 CH per day) - some nice layovers, only one two leg day on each trip, 8 revenue legs for the month.
68.6 x $262/hour = $17,947 for the month
Over on the 777 - a single double deadhead RFO trip for the month:
77.5 CH of pay + 6 CH of over 8 BKO for the month (7 CH per day) - Two-day deadhead to Asia, some nice layovers, one leg a day when you do fly, 3 revenue legs for the month.
83.5 x $215/hour + $8/hour = $18,621 for the month
The bottom line is the "Q" in QOL is subjective. That's the nice thing about FedEx. Lots of options.
Maybe someone can't stand being in an aircraft longer than 2-4 hours at a pop.
Maybe they can hold their hometown layovers.
Maybe they prefer LCA duties.
Maybe they hate riding on commercial aircraft.
Maybe they have reasons they can't spend 12 days gone all at once or just don't like that.
Or maybe they just gotta have those 4-stripes no matter what.
But if none of the above applies and a 2001 hire is working his ass off (relatively speaking) in the left seat of the 757, even at 25% instead of earning more per day as a 777 FO ..... I'll just say - better him than me.
06-02-2018, 06:11 AM
#28
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2007
Posts: 331
Originally Posted by Adlerdriver
There's a wide spectrum of pay scenarios for both seats in this discussion, so to ask for the "average annual pay" for either seat is way too general. Top 25% 757 CA is probably pretty close to top 25% 777 FO - so at least we can talk apples to apples with that.
Raptor hit on a few factors, but the bottom line on this really comes down to credit hours per day of work. Doing a little bid pack kung fu using your favorite bidding software will make most of this readily evident. I'm certainly not interested in convincing someone senior to me that 777 FO is the place to be, but it's really not that difficult to figure out. There is way, way more to this than simply looking at pay rates.
June bidpacks for both seats:
Max days off lines on the 757 (17 days off) pay 68.1 CH or 6.2 CH per day. 3 international Trips. Comprised of 2 leg and 3 leg duty periods. You get 3 round trip commutes to do that (unless you want to kill the 2 dead days between trips in MEM) while flying 12 revenue flights that month.
Max days off line on the 777 (20 days off) pay 69.2 CH or 8.65 CH per day.
2 Trips as an RFO. Both two 2-day front deadheads to HKG, so two "half-commutes" on the back-end of each trip with a paid two day commute to start. One 15.5 hour revenue flight back to MEM each trip for a total of 2 revenue legs that month.
Do the math on those two lines and the 757 CA makes more that month. BUT - a very important BUT - he works 3-extra days to make those additional dollars.
Since the 25% 777 FO can consistently hold carryover, he can choose to plus up his month using a 3-day trip and work the same number of days as the 757 CA above. I'll be conservative and say those 3 extra days pay 6.4 (trip rig) per day. So now - working the same number of days as his 757 CA buddy, he earns 88.4 CH of pay for the month (averaging just over 8 CH of pay per day).
777 FO: $215/hour + $8/hour x 88.4 = $19,713 for the month
757 CA: $262/hour + $10/hour x 69.1 = $18,795 for the month
Pick a more middle of the road scenario: Find some lines with 16 days off each.
A nice two trip month on the 757 both with double deadheads:
68.5 CH of pay for the month (5.7 CH per day) - some nice layovers, only one two leg day on each trip, 8 revenue legs for the month.
68.6 x $262/hour = $17,947 for the month
Over on the 777 - a single double deadhead RFO trip for the month:
77.5 CH of pay + 6 CH of over 8 BKO for the month (7 CH per day) - Two-day deadhead to Asia, some nice layovers, one leg a day when you do fly, 3 revenue legs for the month.
83.5 x $215/hour + $8/hour = $18,621 for the month
The bottom line is the "Q" in QOL is subjective. That's the nice thing about FedEx. Lots of options.
Maybe someone can't stand being in an aircraft longer than 2-4 hours at a pop.
Maybe they can hold their hometown layovers.
Maybe they prefer LCA duties.
Maybe they hate riding on commercial aircraft.
Maybe they have reasons they can't spend 12 days gone all at once or just don't like that.
Or maybe they just gotta have those 4-stripes no matter what.
But if none of the above applies and a 2001 hire is working his ass off (relatively speaking) in the left seat of the 757, even at 25% instead of earning more per day as a 777 FO ..... I'll just say - better him than me.
Raptor hit on a few factors, but the bottom line on this really comes down to credit hours per day of work. Doing a little bid pack kung fu using your favorite bidding software will make most of this readily evident. I'm certainly not interested in convincing someone senior to me that 777 FO is the place to be, but it's really not that difficult to figure out. There is way, way more to this than simply looking at pay rates.
June bidpacks for both seats:
Max days off lines on the 757 (17 days off) pay 68.1 CH or 6.2 CH per day. 3 international Trips. Comprised of 2 leg and 3 leg duty periods. You get 3 round trip commutes to do that (unless you want to kill the 2 dead days between trips in MEM) while flying 12 revenue flights that month.
Max days off line on the 777 (20 days off) pay 69.2 CH or 8.65 CH per day.
2 Trips as an RFO. Both two 2-day front deadheads to HKG, so two "half-commutes" on the back-end of each trip with a paid two day commute to start. One 15.5 hour revenue flight back to MEM each trip for a total of 2 revenue legs that month.
Do the math on those two lines and the 757 CA makes more that month. BUT - a very important BUT - he works 3-extra days to make those additional dollars.
Since the 25% 777 FO can consistently hold carryover, he can choose to plus up his month using a 3-day trip and work the same number of days as the 757 CA above. I'll be conservative and say those 3 extra days pay 6.4 (trip rig) per day. So now - working the same number of days as his 757 CA buddy, he earns 88.4 CH of pay for the month (averaging just over 8 CH of pay per day).
777 FO: $215/hour + $8/hour x 88.4 = $19,713 for the month
757 CA: $262/hour + $10/hour x 69.1 = $18,795 for the month
Pick a more middle of the road scenario: Find some lines with 16 days off each.
A nice two trip month on the 757 both with double deadheads:
68.5 CH of pay for the month (5.7 CH per day) - some nice layovers, only one two leg day on each trip, 8 revenue legs for the month.
68.6 x $262/hour = $17,947 for the month
Over on the 777 - a single double deadhead RFO trip for the month:
77.5 CH of pay + 6 CH of over 8 BKO for the month (7 CH per day) - Two-day deadhead to Asia, some nice layovers, one leg a day when you do fly, 3 revenue legs for the month.
83.5 x $215/hour + $8/hour = $18,621 for the month
The bottom line is the "Q" in QOL is subjective. That's the nice thing about FedEx. Lots of options.
Maybe someone can't stand being in an aircraft longer than 2-4 hours at a pop.
Maybe they can hold their hometown layovers.
Maybe they prefer LCA duties.
Maybe they hate riding on commercial aircraft.
Maybe they have reasons they can't spend 12 days gone all at once or just don't like that.
Or maybe they just gotta have those 4-stripes no matter what.
But if none of the above applies and a 2001 hire is working his ass off (relatively speaking) in the left seat of the 757, even at 25% instead of earning more per day as a 777 FO ..... I'll just say - better him than me.
06-02-2018, 10:52 AM
#29
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Aug 2006
Posts: 1,820
Originally Posted by Adlerdriver
There's a wide spectrum of pay scenarios for both seats in this discussion, so to ask for the "average annual pay" for either seat is way too general. Top 25% 757 CA is probably pretty close to top 25% 777 FO - so at least we can talk apples to apples with that.
Raptor hit on a few factors, but the bottom line on this really comes down to credit hours per day of work. Doing a little bid pack kung fu using your favorite bidding software will make most of this readily evident. I'm certainly not interested in convincing someone senior to me that 777 FO is the place to be, but it's really not that difficult to figure out. There is way, way more to this than simply looking at pay rates.
June bidpacks for both seats:
Max days off lines on the 757 (17 days off) pay 68.1 CH or 6.2 CH per day. 3 international Trips. Comprised of 2 leg and 3 leg duty periods. You get 3 round trip commutes to do that (unless you want to kill the 2 dead days between trips in MEM) while flying 12 revenue flights that month.
Max days off line on the 777 (20 days off) pay 69.2 CH or 8.65 CH per day.
2 Trips as an RFO. Both two 2-day front deadheads to HKG, so two "half-commutes" on the back-end of each trip with a paid two day commute to start. One 15.5 hour revenue flight back to MEM each trip for a total of 2 revenue legs that month.
Do the math on those two lines and the 757 CA makes more that month. BUT - a very important BUT - he works 3-extra days to make those additional dollars.
Since the 25% 777 FO can consistently hold carryover, he can choose to plus up his month using a 3-day trip and work the same number of days as the 757 CA above. I'll be conservative and say those 3 extra days pay 6.4 (trip rig) per day. So now - working the same number of days as his 757 CA buddy, he earns 88.4 CH of pay for the month (averaging just over 8 CH of pay per day).
777 FO: $215/hour + $8/hour x 88.4 = $19,713 for the month
757 CA: $262/hour + $10/hour x 69.1 = $18,795 for the month
Pick a more middle of the road scenario: Find some lines with 16 days off each.
A nice two trip month on the 757 both with double deadheads:
68.5 CH of pay for the month (5.7 CH per day) - some nice layovers, only one two leg day on each trip, 8 revenue legs for the month.
68.6 x $262/hour = $17,947 for the month
Over on the 777 - a single double deadhead RFO trip for the month:
77.5 CH of pay + 6 CH of over 8 BKO for the month (7 CH per day) - Two-day deadhead to Asia, some nice layovers, one leg a day when you do fly, 3 revenue legs for the month.
83.5 x $215/hour + $8/hour = $18,621 for the month
The bottom line is the "Q" in QOL is subjective. That's the nice thing about FedEx. Lots of options.
Maybe someone can't stand being in an aircraft longer than 2-4 hours at a pop.
Maybe they can hold their hometown layovers.
Maybe they prefer LCA duties.
Maybe they hate riding on commercial aircraft.
Maybe they have reasons they can't spend 12 days gone all at once or just don't like that.
Or maybe they just gotta have those 4-stripes no matter what.
But if none of the above applies and a 2001 hire is working his ass off (relatively speaking) in the left seat of the 757, even at 25% instead of earning more per day as a 777 FO ..... I'll just say - better him than me.
Raptor hit on a few factors, but the bottom line on this really comes down to credit hours per day of work. Doing a little bid pack kung fu using your favorite bidding software will make most of this readily evident. I'm certainly not interested in convincing someone senior to me that 777 FO is the place to be, but it's really not that difficult to figure out. There is way, way more to this than simply looking at pay rates.
June bidpacks for both seats:
Max days off lines on the 757 (17 days off) pay 68.1 CH or 6.2 CH per day. 3 international Trips. Comprised of 2 leg and 3 leg duty periods. You get 3 round trip commutes to do that (unless you want to kill the 2 dead days between trips in MEM) while flying 12 revenue flights that month.
Max days off line on the 777 (20 days off) pay 69.2 CH or 8.65 CH per day.
2 Trips as an RFO. Both two 2-day front deadheads to HKG, so two "half-commutes" on the back-end of each trip with a paid two day commute to start. One 15.5 hour revenue flight back to MEM each trip for a total of 2 revenue legs that month.
Do the math on those two lines and the 757 CA makes more that month. BUT - a very important BUT - he works 3-extra days to make those additional dollars.
Since the 25% 777 FO can consistently hold carryover, he can choose to plus up his month using a 3-day trip and work the same number of days as the 757 CA above. I'll be conservative and say those 3 extra days pay 6.4 (trip rig) per day. So now - working the same number of days as his 757 CA buddy, he earns 88.4 CH of pay for the month (averaging just over 8 CH of pay per day).
777 FO: $215/hour + $8/hour x 88.4 = $19,713 for the month
757 CA: $262/hour + $10/hour x 69.1 = $18,795 for the month
Pick a more middle of the road scenario: Find some lines with 16 days off each.
A nice two trip month on the 757 both with double deadheads:
68.5 CH of pay for the month (5.7 CH per day) - some nice layovers, only one two leg day on each trip, 8 revenue legs for the month.
68.6 x $262/hour = $17,947 for the month
Over on the 777 - a single double deadhead RFO trip for the month:
77.5 CH of pay + 6 CH of over 8 BKO for the month (7 CH per day) - Two-day deadhead to Asia, some nice layovers, one leg a day when you do fly, 3 revenue legs for the month.
83.5 x $215/hour + $8/hour = $18,621 for the month
The bottom line is the "Q" in QOL is subjective. That's the nice thing about FedEx. Lots of options.
Maybe someone can't stand being in an aircraft longer than 2-4 hours at a pop.
Maybe they can hold their hometown layovers.
Maybe they prefer LCA duties.
Maybe they hate riding on commercial aircraft.
Maybe they have reasons they can't spend 12 days gone all at once or just don't like that.
Or maybe they just gotta have those 4-stripes no matter what.
But if none of the above applies and a 2001 hire is working his ass off (relatively speaking) in the left seat of the 757, even at 25% instead of earning more per day as a 777 FO ..... I'll just say - better him than me.
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