Shaman

This entire statement codifies why this pilot group is the weakest I've been apart of in nearly 30 years in this business.

We've telegraphed the concessionary horse trading mentality that we have from the beginning. The notion that we were going to "amend" vitally important parts of the contract outside of section 6 says everything we need to know about what the leadership believes is the right direction.

I don't need to wait to read that. Sometimes the baby is stillborn and ya know it in advance.

But you go on ahead.

We are in a position where we are given praise for team effort, but also given the same old "you're a cost to be minimized" treatment. The scary thing is many of the clowns in this joint actually believe that's the way things SHOULD be.

As to this oft repeated, entirely wrong, and misguided prattle about public negotiation, nothing said in this or any other forum matters to negotiations. What matters is WILL YOU ACCEPT ANY CONCESSIONS IN A TA presented? Its pretty damn clear to me lots of folks here will and the NC believes that too. I've been through several airline contract negotiations including at least one other here and never once was the deciding factor what someone said on the internet.

threeighteen

Someone brought it up in a PUB call a while back, MEC shot it down. They're happy being among the short list of union airlines that don't have one.

Some other unions have clauses in their CBAs that posts on the union forum can't be used by the company for disciplinary action against a pilot nor for litigation against the union even if the company manages to get screenshots. So yes, not "private" but also a relatively "safe place" for the pilot group to engage. FedEx pilots do not have a safe place to engage which is why the union is so weak.

Merle Haggard

Not necessarily. The UAL MEC has forums. Their MEC chairman controls the conversation at a level akin to Chairman Mao. Not surprisingly, anything that doesn't perfectly reflect the views of he and his buddies is purged. They wind up using it as an instrument to consolidate and maintain power.

Noworkallplay

Yes, we have places to engage our representatives and it’s called LEC meetings. PUB calls have also been going on since Covid. Kickoff rally just a few months ago also. A simple phone call or email also works. I have engaged with my representative a few times. Having an open forum for people to say whatever they want and having that owned by a union is a massive liability. This is why United pulls stuff from theirs constantly. If you choose not to show up that’s your fault.

jetlaggy

Which union would this be?

Noworkallplay

The poster is misinformed. No such “clause” exists in the USA and would never hold up in court. As we all know anything can be used against you in court, especially if it can be construed as a work action or slander.

Noworkallplay

I was at a legacy previous to this. You are incorrect. Every negotiations has areas in which pilots get stuff and areas the company gets something. Usually the amount that one side gets compared to another has to do with who has the bargaining power. Look at the bankruptcy era. The pay raises gained by the passenger airlines post bankruptcy era have been funded by scope/code share gives. PBS also funded gains a legacy airlines in the past 10 years. Now the favor is on the side of labor. But to act as if it’s called negotiations for another reason is ill educated.

Why do you think wide-body jobs make up a fraction of the jobs a legacy airlines now?

opt0712

This isn't UAL. It seems you had quite a fire on the UAL boards when you were there. I'd implore you to bring that same fire here at purple and get involved with our union.

BLOB

What is the sound that is made when a tree falls over in the forest and nobody is there to care that the tree was at a legacy before?

Merle Haggard

The point was that a union sponsored board is A) Not a panacea and B) can be easily misused by the leadership. An example would be a constant scrubbing of the board to ensure that only posts supportive of a pancake retirement plan make the cut. That is the type of thing that goes on at UAL ALPA forum. If you want to see just what the MEC wants you to see, then let's go ahead and get ourselves an ALPA sponsored forum. Finally, I have never worked at UAL - just have some vested interests there.