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Old 06-07-2023 | 11:58 AM
  #11  
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Originally Posted by Shaman
...WE WILL NOT SETTLE...
Excellent post, Shaman.
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Old 06-07-2023 | 12:46 PM
  #12  
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PM and the NC has made it clear that improving retirement was the main focus. When the NC is on the cusp of retirement, can you blame them? However, I have up to 25 years left and I told the NC via survey that any concessions to what we currently have would be a no vote. I’m excited to see this TA, but im
pretty certain there are some major give backs. The lack of saliency throughout this process has been absolutely detrimental to unity.
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Old 06-07-2023 | 01:34 PM
  #13  
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Oddly Scope isn't on there for all those complaining about scope.
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Old 06-07-2023 | 01:38 PM
  #14  
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Originally Posted by magic rat;[url=tel:3647438
3647438[/url]]It only took 2 posts for someone to b!tch about something. Well done.
And Go Gators….

thought I’d get to it early before scrolling through 5 pages of them.
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Old 06-07-2023 | 02:29 PM
  #15  
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Originally Posted by Jumbo Pilot
.....

I have no inside knowledge, but has anyone considered that our proposal on pay rates was Industry Leading Hourly Rates plus X%? That way, what was relevant 2 years ago no longer applies today and allows us to negotiate using pattern bargaining........


JP
I totally understand your willingness to believe but it doesn't really matter. We must press these people. We must make them understand this isn't 1995 or 2001 or any other year where employers could have cart blache on whom they hired and what it took to retain them. We have marketable skills and the period of scarcity for them has nowhere near reach its nadir. Drones cannot remedy this and age extensions won't do it either. They will have to invest in their human capital. We've all been conditioned to believe that wage inflation is a bad thing and its ok to force workers to work harder for less. But the generation that enabled that is sunsetting. The subsequent generations cannot plug that whole either because there's not enough of us or because they diminished the profession so far that only the most passionate would consider pursuing the long road to the positions we now occupy.

Given this I believe we should demand they give is what we rightly deserve and what the market demands. I don't believe the leadership here believes this to be true and they don't seem to have any fight in them. The entire mindset is get what you can and get out the door.

If the company wants to downsize our positions because they think truckers are cheaper we should demand that those remaining be given even more in compensation as you can be assured we will be working longer and hard in the same seats if all their grand plans come true. There's no rule that says we should only ask for what "they" got plus a nickel. How about what they got plus 5%? Why not start there?

We can do this. We don't have to settle. Do not listen to those who would minimize your value. They can lampoon us all they want for expecting better pay and working conditions. We know what we are worth. We should pity them because they don't.

And this company can afford it. If they can spend 5 billion dollars to purchase shares with the sole benefit being that others will believe that those shares are worth more because there less of them. They can certainly afford to increase our pension to meet the irs limit. I could easily argue the latter has more value to the company. Hell almost anything would.

But know they're not going to give it to us. Power conedes nothing with out a demnd. Youre not going to reason or rationalize them into acknowledging our value. Were not going to mutally focus on achieving anything. They want to win and so do we and theyve tilted the table in their favor. So we must hold the MEC to account. If our pay isn't better than the top payrate out there make them start again. If we are short the meager goals they put forth make them start again. If it takes another year so be it.

No one has to listen to me but if what I'm saying speaks to you share it and the call your reps and have your friends do the same.
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Old 06-07-2023 | 03:42 PM
  #16  
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Originally Posted by Stan446
Oddly Scope isn't on there for all those complaining about scope.
Look at multiple posts I’ve made.
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Old 06-08-2023 | 04:12 AM
  #17  
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From: 4A2FU
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Originally Posted by Shaman
I totally understand your willingness to believe but it doesn't really matter. We must press these people. We must make them understand this isn't 1995 or 2001 or any other year where employers could have cart blache on whom they hired and what it took to retain them. We have marketable skills and the period of scarcity for them has nowhere near reach its nadir. Drones cannot remedy this and age extensions won't do it either. They will have to invest in their human capital. We've all been conditioned to believe that wage inflation is a bad thing and its ok to force workers to work harder for less. But the generation that enabled that is sunsetting. The subsequent generations cannot plug that whole either because there's not enough of us or because they diminished the profession so far that only the most passionate would consider pursuing the long road to the positions we now occupy.

Given this I believe we should demand they give is what we rightly deserve and what the market demands. I don't believe the leadership here believes this to be true and they don't seem to have any fight in them. The entire mindset is get what you can and get out the door.

If the company wants to downsize our positions because they think truckers are cheaper we should demand that those remaining be given even more in compensation as you can be assured we will be working longer and hard in the same seats if all their grand plans come true. There's no rule that says we should only ask for what "they" got plus a nickel. How about what they got plus 5%? Why not start there?

We can do this. We don't have to settle. Do not listen to those who would minimize your value. They can lampoon us all they want for expecting better pay and working conditions. We know what we are worth. We should pity them because they don't.

And this company can afford it. If they can spend 5 billion dollars to purchase shares with the sole benefit being that others will believe that those shares are worth more because there less of them. They can certainly afford to increase our pension to meet the irs limit. I could easily argue the latter has more value to the company. Hell almost anything would.

But know they're not going to give it to us. Power conedes nothing with out a demnd. Youre not going to reason or rationalize them into acknowledging our value. Were not going to mutally focus on achieving anything. They want to win and so do we and theyve tilted the table in their favor. So we must hold the MEC to account. If our pay isn't better than the top payrate out there make them start again. If we are short the meager goals they put forth make them start again. If it takes another year so be it.

No one has to listen to me but if what I'm saying speaks to you share it and the call your reps and have your friends do the same.
well said…
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Old 06-08-2023 | 08:41 AM
  #18  
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Emailed my rep yesterday, was not impressed at all by his response. Prepare for a concessionary TA folks I think the rumors are true about this TA, they are preparing their sales team.
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Old 06-08-2023 | 11:06 AM
  #19  
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Originally Posted by Coffeepilot1
Emailed my rep yesterday, was not impressed at all by his response. Prepare for a concessionary TA folks I think the rumors are true about this TA, they are preparing their sales team.
Hopefully the pilot group does its job and votes it down then. Everyone talks about the mistake of passing the 2015 contract, looks like we are going to get our chance to not let it happen again. If the rumors are true, it'll be a poor choice for the union to try and push another concessionary contract through.
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Old 06-08-2023 | 11:16 AM
  #20  
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Originally Posted by Coffeepilot1
Emailed my rep yesterday, was not impressed at all by his response. Prepare for a concessionary TA folks I think the rumors are true about this TA, they are preparing their sales team.
You aren't impressed because it doesn't fit your agenda. How about looking at the TA first? But spread the fear.
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