aerospacepilot

Here are a few key points I want to make.

1. You can get your training as fast (or faster) at a local FBO than you can at ATP.

There is no secret as to how ATP trains people so fast. All you do is fly a lot. You can fly as often as you want at an FBO too. The nice part is YOU are in control of your schedule. If you want to fly your butt off one week, and take the weekend off the next week, you can do that. At ATP, you are on THEIR schedule. You cannot make that choice. You can get all your ratings in under 5 months at a local FBO, you just have to fly everyday.

2. ATP costs about $30,000 more than most local FBO's!

$30,000 is a big deal to most people. It should be to you too. At ATP, it costs $64,000 to get all your licenses and ratings. At a local FBO with reasonable rates, it should cost about $35,000 to get all your licenses and ratings. If you don't believe me, PM me aircraft rates, instructor costs, and any joining/member fees, and I will give you a very accurate budget. Think of all the things you could buy with the $30,000 you saved by not going to ATP. ATP is just expensive brand named flight training. It is no better than any local FBO, in fact it is probably lower quality. Don't waste $30,000.

3. The quality of instruction at ATP is probably not as good as the instruction you get at a local FBO

This varies person to person, flight school to flight school. But allow me to point out some general trends. At ATP, they train you just enough to pass the checkride. By going so fast, there is no way you absorbed everything you were supposed to learn.

The instructors at ATP may not be the best either. ATP's program is designed for brand new instructors to come in, teach for a few months, and then move on. No one stays at ATP as a career instructor. So you do not have the benefit of their extensive experience. Doing my training at a local FBO, almost all of my instruction has been with instructors who have had more than 10,000 hours. Go into ATP and tell them you want an instructor with just 2,000 hours. They will laugh at you. At a local FBO, you have a much better chance of getting an instructor who has been around the block a few times. Learning from experience is one of the best and most valuable ways to learn. Period. At ATP, there is a damn good chance your instructor (the person entrusted with your safety, and the person directly responsible for your learning) had never touched an airplane 6 months ago!! That's just the way it is.
If you truly want to get the most out of your training, you should get an experienced instructor at a local FBO.

4. Airlines do not care where you got your training from
With the way regional airlines are hiring, there is no big advantage getting training from ATP. That RJ standards course is not required, and it is just a waste of $6,000. None of the good regional airlines (ExpressJet, Horizon, Republic, and Skywest) will lower their minimums even 1 hour because you have this unnecessary course.


Going to ATP will not let you get ahead anymore than someone else who trained fast at their local FBO.

I hope you make the right decision for yourself, ATPwannabe!
You know where I (and most everyone else on this board stand).
Good luck.

t-cart

Het atpwannabe,Good luck with your medical,We are pulling for you. FLY SAFE T.C.

de727ups

"I mean not going anywhere anytime soon."

You think so? Non-ACPP CFI salary is $1200/mo. The whole point of ATP is get in, get your multi, and get out. If a guy wanted to CFI for a while, he could do much better outside the ATP system. I hear there is an occasional high time CFI at ATP. Not sure what motivates them. If you can find one, more power to ya. I'd bet the vast majority are the low timers looking to move on ASAP. Look at the ATP website. The whole point of the place is to get to a regional at min time with min standards.

tangoindia

atp.....jajaja you gotta be kidding me!...

LeoSV

I was close to going to ATP again about 3 months ago, but the cost is too much to bear. The repayment will be $612/mo for 20 years. And I already have my PPL. Add the other $9k in for the PPL and the payment goes up to $709/mo for 20 years. Perhaps if I was single and didn't care about anything, but even then it's a tough sell at that price. You, on the other hand, may have it a little different. You said that your dad may help you with about $40k. Well, that means you only finance $30k. Your payments would be significantly less, but you'll still be around $300/month for 20 years. Other than the money, I believe they have a good program. I am really enjoying the FBO thing though. It's more like a family. We have cookouts, flyouts, hanger parties, there's very little turn-over, and I get to enjoy flying in general aviation for longer. I like being able to rent the plane and buzz my mom's house, or fly to the mountains with my friend, or the best will be taking my dad up. ATP is a fastlane to the 121 world. I used to want that, but there's so much more to flying than just work.

atpwannabe

That's what I'm talking about. This guy really took a geniune interest in my situation. He read my explanations and was shaking his head in agreement the entire time. As a matter of fact, below is how I started and ended my letter. For obvious reasons, I left out the body of letter. The one conviction mentioned below is for a bad check.

Btw, I put my username in place of my real name...just in case anybody wants to know.

"This letter has been constructed to give an honest and transparent account of each of the incidences that appear in this NCIC report generated by the Federal Bureau of Investigation for the purposes of issuing a First Class Medical certificate to me, atpwannabe.


While reflecting on the incidences that are listed in this report, I wish that I would have exercised better judgment at the time of each occurrence. My hope is that in each instance where the judicial system had dropped the charges because of my innocence, my hope is that the FAA will not hold it against me as well. The one incidence where prosecution did take place, I take full responsibility and hold myself accountable. In addition, I further understand that making similar decisions of that magnitude as a professional pilot could cost me my life, the life of my Captain, other flight crewmembers and my passengers. I have learned my lesson. Having to deal with the anxiety and pressure of possibly being denied the First Class Medical certificate is a very humbling experience. From this point forward, I ask to be afforded the opportunity to either stand or fall by my decisions or actions taken in pursuit of the career of a professional pilot.

Having the opportunity to become professional pilot operating under Part(s) 91, 121, or 135 has been a life long dream. There would be no need to create, form or manufacture enthusiasm, desire, or interest for the profession because it has always existed. Flying as a professional pilot will challenge me intellectually, physically, and emotionally on a daily basis. I am up for the challenge!

With that said, please accept the aforementioned as an honest, transparent and comprehensive explanation of said NCIC report and to be awarded the First Class Medical Certificate.

Respectfully,


atpwannabe


And believe you me, just waiting for a response can make you age. It feels like an eternity. Man...it's like I'm sitting on the edge of my bed, sucking down a bottle of Ensure & Maalox, wringing my hands hoping that everything is gonna turn out ok.

No, but seriously, I'm waiting patiently. When one door closes and you're waiting for another to open...it can be HELL standing in the hallway.



atp

atpwannabe

Again de727ups your are right, however, being a graduate of the ACPP and being an instructor @ the SUA location (Stuart, FL) would give me $2200.00/mo for the time being while I instructed to build my TT. I think having a total of 800-1000 hours would be good for me given my situation. And just like others here on the board, there are bills to be paid.

Not really sure how busy they are @ SUA, but it's all ME time. In addition, if I am awarded the 1st Class Medical, the regionals may want to see some sort of track record if you will. I'm not oppose to that. As my dad always told me..."it's better to have it and not need it, than to need it and not have it."

atpwannabe

LeoSV:

Yeah...I've always wanted to be an airline pilot. You see, when I first went to Riddle, my grades were average. My dad said he wanted to see better grades before he forked over that kind of cash. They came along...in my junior and senior year . By that time, I was well into the airport management degree program. I acquired a government student loan to finance my college education. My monthly payments are $416/mo to Nelnet. It helps to have a wife that works also.

My parents NEVER said that they wouldn't send me to flight school. They are both retire school teachers. I'm eternally grateful for them and they understand my passion for flying. They would actually pay for all my training at ATP and I'm so grateful that they would still want to do that for me even at this stage in both of our lives.

I get that same FBO family type feeling at Aeronautix Flight School at one of the local FBO's here in Palm Beach County. When I went up for my discovery flight, I felt very comfortable with the instructor who is a former Delta Captain and with the sales rep who has no flying experience.


atp

atpwannabe

Thanks, bro.

atp

t-cart

atp,Are you a member of AOPA? They have a medical team,and aviation attorneys you can talk to about these types of situations.From just being on the forums,They seem to help people. Good luck to you. T.C.