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Old 01-10-2008, 12:32 PM   #1  
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Default Complex endorsement???

This may seem like a silly basic question but am curious if I need it. Do I need a complex endorsement just to rent a Piper Arrow?

Reason I ask is I am military and did not aquire my ratings in the usual process progressing up through all the ratings. Here is what I have: SEL, MEL, and RW commercial-Instrument, ME ATP. I fly RC-12's and have BE300 series type rating. I do have a high performance sign off from flying FSI 182's during the start of the Army FWMEQC.
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Old 01-10-2008, 01:06 PM   #2  
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Complex pertains to airplanes with retractable gear, flaps, and constant speed prop. It has got to have all 3 to qualify as complex. I am not sure if some variations of Arrrows might have all 3 items.

Last edited by Cubdriver; 01-10-2008 at 02:56 PM.
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Old 01-10-2008, 01:14 PM   #3  
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Thanks for the answer, but I was aware of the complex details part of the aircraft. The Piper Arrow does have all three. The local FBO has one for rent but I do not have a "complex endorsement" in my logbook although I fly a multi-engine turbo-prop aircraft everyday here in Iraq.

I am asking can I fly a general aviation "complex" aircraft based on I already fly a much more complex aircraft along with type rating.

Like I said, I have a high performance endorsement, but I went from that straight to multi-engine turbine after 3200 hours flying AH-64 Apaches.
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Old 01-10-2008, 03:16 PM   #4  
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You might have to take a CFI with you to get checked out. But given what you fly, I'd say it will be short. Since you have an ATP which is usually done in a complex A/C, I'd say they won't give you too much trouble. Talk to the FBO and see what they can do for you.
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Old 01-10-2008, 07:54 PM   #5  
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I agree with "the King." Won't hurt, least it'll be in your book and simplify things in the future.
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Old 01-10-2008, 08:12 PM   #6  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Raildriver View Post
Thanks for the answer, but I was aware of the complex details part of the aircraft. The Piper Arrow does have all three. The local FBO has one for rent but I do not have a "complex endorsement" in my logbook although I fly a multi-engine turbo-prop aircraft everyday here in Iraq.

I am asking can I fly a general aviation "complex" aircraft based on I already fly a much more complex aircraft along with type rating.

Like I said, I have a high performance endorsement, but I went from that straight to multi-engine turbine after 3200 hours flying AH-64 Apaches.
When I was working with the AF these issues came up quite a bit. Unfortunately you'll still need the civilian signoff. Reason being is military avaition and civil avaition are seperate groups. It sucks I know as most mil guys are above and beyond anything joe blow civi ever hopes to be.

I remember some of the guys getting waivers or having their military licenses converted but I'm unsure. I hope others can help. Either way there is no time requirement so just do a lap around the pattern with someone and get your book signed then go have some fun
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Old 01-10-2008, 08:27 PM   #7  
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To act as PIC of a high-performance airplane you must have:

a: Logged and received ground and flight training from an authorized flight instructor in a high-performance airplane, or in a flight simulator or flight training device that is representative of a high-performance airplane and have been found proficient in the operation of systems of that airplane.

b: Received and logged a one-time endorsement in your logbook from an authorized instructor who certifies you are proficient to operate a high-performance airplane.


Hope that helps. It's from my PPL oral exam guide.
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Old 01-11-2008, 12:11 AM   #8  
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I have a high performance endorsement, but not a complex. I do have all my civilian ratings, just not the "complex" endorsement for an airplane that has constant speed prop, flaps, and retractable landing gear, even though the airplane I fly everyday has all that plus 1200shp a side.
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Old 01-11-2008, 03:13 AM   #9  
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[delete post]

Last edited by Cubdriver; 01-11-2008 at 03:25 AM.
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Old 01-11-2008, 10:57 AM   #10  
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Well to rent thew plane they require 5 hours dual with them, so endorsement required or not I'll have it after I have met their rental requirements. Just funny that I have flown a lot of fixed gear high performance and have thousands of hours in big acft but have to do 5 hours dual. I could understand 1 hour dual to check-out like before I rent a 172.
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