atpwannabe

You'd think that for as long as been a member of APC, I'd know all the particulars by now. Funny how the mind works...anyway, if each of you, who cares to, could share pros and cons of Part 61 -vs- 141, I'd appreciate. it.

I've got two monthly expenses. Child support being one and cell phone totaling $420/mo. That's it. I know....I'm lucky. At any rate, I called the AriBen and was told that I could do 61 and work PT and still take advantage of campus housing. Just wanna get some feedback on this in terms of doing 61 and working PT or do you think 141 should be the way I go; meaning that I get everything out of the way, then start instructing and playing catch up on my bills.

Btw, I was approved for unemp comp. Thought about using that while in training to cover monthly expenses, but I don't know if that's legal or not.



atp

rickair7777

I would only do 141 if you had a very specific reason for doing so, ie GI Bill, university flight program, etc.

While 141 could theoretically be cheaper due to fewer required hours, in my experience it doesn't work out that way because you always end up going over the minimum hours for PPL and IR, and the schools tend to charge more for 141 hours anyway so they can rip off veterans).

As are as unemployment...I think you can use the money for anything you want as long as you meet the requirements to receive it in the first place...this usually means you have to be looking for a job, but re-training for another career might be legal too. Better as the unemployment office.

But you might want to keep applying for jobs while training, just to CYA. If you are careful about what you apply for, you probably won't get any job offers

Senior Skipper

I have both part 61 and 141 students- private and instrument (never done a 141 multi). For the private, there's essentially no difference. For the IFR, part 141 gives you a lot more time with the CFI, but you have less total time.

I'd say do either one for your private, and do your IFR part 61. That way you get to go explore the country and build some real PIC experience- not having a CFI there to hold your hand really does lots for your decision making ability. You may even scare yourself once or twice.

PearlPilot

Agreed. For the PPL it really does not matter. There are some minute differences between part 61 and 141. When it comes to the IR then it's a whole different world. 190 hours ( part 141) for the CPL vs. 250 hours (part 61). Also if you did your IR part 141, you don't have to log 50 hours of cross country. I did my PPL and IR part 61 and if I could do it again, I wouldn't change a thing. I gained a lifetime of valuable experience in the 50 hours of cross country time I built. I explored many destinations, made PIC decisions, experienced both good and bad weather, got the opportunity to make "go, no-go" decisions, met some great pilots along the way, had a great time planning for flights, and most of all, I thoroughly enjoyed just being up there. I combined some of those cross country time to go under the hood and get a head start on attitude instrument flying. That time eventually counted toward the 40 hours of hood time required for the IR. It also made me get my instrument rating in just 7 months. All in all, I highly recommend the part 61 way, because IMHP it will enable you the opportunity to become a better pilot. Good luck and let us know how you do.

PearlPilot

Oh yes, this is a great point and if you really think about it, this is a really good way to experience some good in-flight decisions first hand. This will undoubtedly make you a stronger, competent aviator. One tends to become lax when an instructor is aboard. And yes, I have had my share of scary experiences too.

rotorhead1026

What's your part-time job? I wouldn't give it up, even if you went 141, and even after you have your CFI ratings. You know from reading this board that you won't "catch up" on many bills while instructing. You should be able to work in your training / flying around the job regardless. In the happy event your student workload increases to the point where your job is interfering - then it would be time to quit (maybe ).

Have you settled on Ari Ben or are you still looking? The most important thing is to find a place / instructor (s) you like, then go with what looks like the best program there. There's normally no compelling advantage to 141 cost-wise, unless it's subsidized.

These are nice problems to discuss, huh? (Compared to here you were a month or so ago).

atpwannabe

Thanks for the responses.

Part 61 would be better for me if I were a little younger and had more cash. My training is being done on somebody else's dime. @ Rickair: I'm just gonna have to buckle down and let nothing distract me. Staying focused and taking advantage of all the resources at my disposal and try not to have to repeat any portion of training that's gonna cost extra.

Not doing the zero to hero thing either. I'm 49. Definitely on a timetable . I know that 121 is out of the question, so I'm focusing my efforts on getting to the instructing level, instruct for a least a year or so, then hopefully head off to a 91/135 outfit.

Spoke to Angela this morning from Ari Ben and she told me that the Pro Pilot program is all 141. Like Senior Skipper and Pearl Pilot said, I would spend more time with the CFI during my IR training and have less TT, however, she noted that I would get the opportunity to get that "PIC/decision-making" experience criss-crossing the state at night with another student and on actual "cross-country" flights. She said, with the school's approval, me & another student would fly a Duchess say from KFPR-PNS-DAL-PHX-LAX and back during the time-building phase of training. Costs of room & board are on me. Fuel cost would be reimbursed upon arrival back in Fort Pierce.

My part-time job that I had in the past was detailing cars. Wouldn't mind doing some CSR work. Maybe 20 hrs/wk. Gotta see how all of this is gonna come together when I get up there though.

@ rotor: Discussing issues such as these is much better.



atp

whiskeycharlie

I agree with the above posters that whether you do your private under 141 or 61 doesn't really matter. I don't think that many people manage to get their private certificate in 35 hours (141) nowadays anyway.
If you do your instrument rating under Part 61, you will need 50 PIC cross country hours to be eligible for your IR checkride. I imagine you'll obtain around 5-7 of those hours throughout your private training and probably about the same amount during your instrument training. That leaves you with 35-40 additional xc hours required. Obtaining this time can be fun, and will make you a better pilot, but it may be more expensive (141 does not have such a requirement). However, splitting the cost of this time with another student by putting one of you under the hood, will help reduce costs.
When you are ready to pursue your commercial certificate, I'd suggest examining your TT. If you have less than 130 hours TT, it may be more cost effective for you to enroll in a 141 program. To obtain your commercial under 61, you need 250 TT; whereas under 141, you just need to complete their 120 hour syllabus.

PearlPilot

Either way you decide to go, good luck ATP and let us know how you do.

csh405

Go part 141- you'll end up with less total time but its the time your paying for. Also those schools which are part 141 approved usually have a better track record.