Brad54

I spoke with a CS pilot that said he was demoted from a check airman captain to captain and pay was cut over paper work issues. Is this common place? I am sure there is more to the story than what I was told. I am wondering if the CS guys are being treated lousy because they have no union to fight for them?

correcting

CS pilot in this case was treated lousy because the person/people that took this supposed action is an a-hole. No union doesn't mean lousy treatment (except in aviation).

CS pilots are however unable to fight back against this behavior because they don't have a union.

SevereClear

Union this, Union that...you people make me sick.

When did you wake up one day and decide that you'd want a "representative" to "represent" you? Here's an idea: Go knock on someone's door and have a civil conversation. Or can't you speak for yourself?

But, hey - go ahead and hide behind the yoke...that'll get a lot accomplished.

You people have no clue how good you have it. You get to wake up in the morning, be around aircraft all day (even if it is at the FBO on standby) and then you get to fly at FL410 with the best view in the house.

Go work in an office for a day with no windows.

There are people in this world that will never have the opportunity to do what you're doing. None of them will ever be able to flip through their logbooks one day and remember all the great places that YOU HAVE BEEN! You travel the region, the country, the world...some never get to leave their hometown's backyard.

Being a pilot used to be - and still is - a very honorable profession. Nobody forced you into this field...you CHOSE it because at one point you loved it.

Some of you CLEARLY don't.

PearlPilot

Wow! Well said. A very rare kind of post indeed. I love browsing through these forums and reading about how it is to be a pro-pilot as I am still in college struggling to get it done. I am right now at an office cubicle with no windows. I am not saying I hate this job, but I would so much love to hang out in an airport!!!

aero550

Being a check airman is a very paper work driven responsibility. I could see how a demotion could occur if the individual in question was submitting paperwork in a subpar fashion. Two sides to every story.

paidtowait

Pretty nice for a first post ... I can see that you are well on your way to being the very best self representative you can be.

as to the "...people in this world...", well some opportunities are presented , lets say by divine intervention (luck) but most however are truly gained through hard work , perseverance and well , Money.

as to the "...you people ... get to wake up...etc", well if aviation is something that you would like to be involved in then I suggest that you get started and wake up every morning, like me and many others have done and go to the airport and hang out or whatever it takes to get involved. I spent my first 17 years working on aircraft as a Mechanic at all kinds of airports at all hours of the day and night in all kinds of weather. Was that something that I got to do ? No, like many others it was a sacrifice I made to achieve my goal.
So next time you think that flying is something that we get to do, think again , it is a profession with great responsibility, and to want to be treated as such is only natural.

correcting

SevereClear obviously has no idea what it's like to be a pilot for a career. It's entirely different than just being some private pilot that gets to tool around the patch once in a while. I won't even begin to try to address the management/pilot dynamics that make unions a virtual necessity in this business. "Go knock on someone's door and have a civil conversation". Now that's funny. And it's always so easy to do when my boss is located in some off airport office 1000 miles away.

Oh wow, we get to hang around airplanes all the time. Yeah, that will wear off after a few years. It's no different than if you got to hang around cars all the time. After a while, they're all just cars.

Oh, think of all the great places you get to see. Uh, you mean like the hotel and maybe 2 miles around the hotel at every airport we go to. We're lucky if we have enough rest time to go get a beer, let alone go sightseeing. I've been to every corner of the western hemisphere, yet I've seen virtually none of it due to the demands of our schedules. And let's not forget how much fun it is to spend all those nights away from home. Yippieee.

Oh wait, I almost forgot about the medical exam every 6 months and the checkride every 6 months and if I fail any of them, my career is in jeopardy.

Would you believe that a lot of us have fantasies about living your kind of life? What do you think we talk about up there for 4 hours while making our fifth trip across the country this week? How nice would it be to have a regular 8-5 schedule. How great would it be to have a nice lunch break each day. And to be home in my own bed every night!! What a dream!!

If you want to be a professional pilot, go for it. Expect that you will spend about 30 grand on training for a couple years and work your way into a cushy job with a commuter making 30k/year (gross) and working 22 days a month. I've been flying professionally for 8 years now and I still love it and have no intention of quitting. The majority of us had to work our asses off to earn it. Yes, it can be lots of fun. But at the end of the day, it's still just a job. Live the life of a professional pilot for a few years. See how much glamour there is for you after that. Just remember, the grass is always greener until you reach the other side.

NOW GIVE ME BACK MY STAPLER!

cac737

Severe Clear, you sir are the type of person that explains just why unions exist. This is your first post (i wonder if you will ever come back here again) and you start barking like some ghetto trash dog? Your argument that we hang around airplanes all day long and fly at FL410, and see the world? Clearly you are as misinformed as you are diplomatic.

You speak of working in an office with no windows as a direct opposite and a hell as compared to the heaven and nirvana that is the most honorable and profession pilot.

Where that supposed lowly person works, he goes home to his family every night. He doesn't miss birthdays, he is there to be a husband and father every day and night. He has no idea what skype is or knows what cities or countries are in what time zones. We do what we do for many reasons, each person has a different one, but while the pilot is away at FL410 or in Los Angeles Sheraton with 8hours from cockpit back to cockpit to do it all over again, that office warrior is sleeping in his own bed.

Whether in an office or a pilot, each is entitled to further pursue his professional goals with or without the help of organized labor. Am I for a do-nothing insanely high paying union job?....no.....but if I am going to be away from my family and in my contract it states that I owe 16 days of work and the company tries to force me to work 18 and I don't then I get fired! A union is there to protect you from this and get you your job back when idiots decide to ignore work rules at a whim.

If you truly don't understand aviation and or unions in aviation, there are many on here, me included, that wouldn't mind educating you on any particulars.

If your post was made as a malicious attack with no intentions of contributing to meaningful dialogue......then you have just totally inserted your foot in your ass then in your mouth by proving to everyone that you just can't have meaningful dialogue with every single person.

Have a nice day in your cubicle, and when you go home read your children an extra story tonight for every pilot who isn't home to read to his own.

cac737

You have got to be kidding me! Since you mentioned that you are still on college, I will remind myself that you just don't know better....

Look, I was there and I still remember what college was like. My advice to you is to pursue a career as a pilot if you truly love to fly. If you seek vast fortune, prestige, notoriety, to be well heeled and traveled and have lunch in NY and dinner in ROME, then look elsewhere.

Especially in the begining this will be one the hardest undertakings anyone will ever take in a career, yet be one of the most rewarding experiences in the world.....if your heart is in the right place to begin with.

Best of luck with your endeavors....

KoruPilot

First post and he comes out like that. . .

Best guess is that this is not the lad's first alias. Likely went off like that before and was either banned or nobody pays attention to him. . . perhaps the way to continue to deal with him.