Who really cares if management or Indigo are concerned. The pilots are concerned. And the more the pilots are concerned, the more people will bail, the less people wlll show up, and this place will be shrinking faster than management can stop it. And in my opinion, raising first year pay isn’t going to even begin to solve the problem. Attrition is coming from everywhere….not just probationary pilots.

You’re probably right about the delivery schedule. I went back and looked at the Q3 earnings summary again and it was no deliveries in 4q 2021. Not sure where I got 2q 2022 from. Anyway, all that notwithstanding, 152 pilots short is not going to make the wheels come off this place yet. Percentage wise based on airline size at the time, we’ve operated with less than that in the past. Like I said above: PAF galore and reserves not getting paid to sit around very much. It’s not ideal, but we’ll hobble along.

I’m certainly not saying any of this is good or acceptable, but people need to get a grip on themselves and take a breath.

Good God man. Splash some cold water on your face and get off the ledge. Remember, this isn’t a Frontier specific problem. Anyone who isn’t UAL, AA, DL, FDX or UPS are experiencing the same thing. I would argue that being at the bottom of a legacy list comes with its own gamble at the moment, but there will always be people who will follow the bright neon lights to a strip club with std laden geriatric strippers because the sign says “free beer”.

I do agree with you though that it will take more than raising first year pay. The entire slope of our pay scale needs to be readjusted. Let’s just hope that the senior papas and mamas on the 12 year line realize that their own self preservation in the future may require them to not eat their young and might mean not getting as much on their end so people below them can have more.

That also brings me to this… contract negotiations are right around the corner. Do you not think that the company will use the fear of shrinkage (I WAS IN THE POOL!) to their advantage to get the pilot group to vote “yes”? You need to relax. If you’re this shaken by *this*, you are about to be reduced to a pile of useless goo in the corner when negotiations start.

I'm not in management. Never have been, never will be. Im just a regular ol' line pilot.

I've waited 3+ hours to get a gate after landing multiple times here. And guess what? I got paid a bunch of money to look at my phone, chat with my coworkers and then I went home and enjoyed my life. And if you don't think that other airlines have their problems too.... you're just clueless.

Being a pilot is a great job, if you can keep a good attitude. If you have a crap attitude here, you'll have a crap attitude wrapped in a different uniform at United or Delta. (I'm not speaking directly to you petpipai, just in general to all the people who love to b*tch)

Every airline has problems. Take a look at how JetBlue handled this blizzard in the Northeast. They left thousands of people stranded at JFK. Looked like a war zone. They took a ton of flak on social media. People were ****ed! And then guess what happened? The pilots got to go on their days off, got paid on pay day, got money dumped into their 401k and got to keep their health insurance. Life goes on.

And again, as for our little attrition problem: its just the leverage we need to get a better contract in the next round! As a pilot group, we want to see some attrition! If we have no attrition, what leverage would we have to get pay raises in the next round?? Plus, I'll gladly take some premium trips in the meantime. I haven't had a single premium trip alert in a week, so our staffing issues must not be that bad! Yet. But bring it on.

Let's let the supply and demand for pilots work in our favor

Next class is Feb 28

The lack of pilots in class has more to do with the lack of hiring resources and recognition that there was a problem from the decision makers than anything else at this point. Hopefully now that they're starting to refill the hiring resources, things will get better. Quite a bit more work to be done on this front though.

So the want 40 and 10 show…..
15 leave for greener pastures
net loss of 5
to catch up …. next month need 40 + 5 lost + 40 previous month + 15 more moving on = 100?

stellar management 😉

What do you mean?

Shhhhh dont do the math. But Ill cover the next couple excuses quick:

Things are fine here....
We dont need as many pilots as what people think....
Premium time will solve it all...
It will help us in negotiations because the company will have to make a deal quick...
First year pay and hotels will solve the problem...

Did I cover the bulk of them?

The entire FO scale is 20-30% low. That’s the real real problem. You can make so much more as an FO at legacies it makes a jump extremely easy.