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Originally Posted by jetlagging
(Post 2784674)
looks like somebody’s drunk on the Hawaiian Punch
Because working for a LCC selling hawaiian fumunda cheese is the apex of any aviation career. It’s annoying you know. The whole Hawaiian routine. Nobody buys it except your own employees. United for example has way more locals working for them than Hawaiian. And they don’t serve cheese or hide behind the curtains during the flights. Hawaiian air can thank their success on ATA and Aloha shutting down at the same time. Hawaiian was never a superior product. No we don’t know each other, so I can promise you that out of all of the pilots on property here, there are NOT many that stay further away from the Hawaiian punch than I do. At times, I can be one of this places larger critics but at the same time I do give credit where credit is due. You sure keep harping on the “local stuff”. I don’t know your background, but sorry it’s the 21st-century. Your ZIP CODE should not apply when going to work for a company. Yeah, I do mean in all 50 states. Even here. There. How’s THAT for not drinking the punch? Hiring should be based solely off of merit and qualifications. Again, sorry you didn’t get the job. Like with any company that includes airlines, everyone goes through their phases. HA was NOT always top notch. Credit where credit is due, the company recognized its errors and corrected them. We might be the smallest fish in the bowl, but I still say that we currently we have the best product in the Western world. Everything that you are saying about Hawaiian, can also be applied to Continental and United. Both of those airlines were but one dying gasp of breath away from going out of business at one point and time also in the last 30 years. Things change. Get over yourself. |
Originally Posted by WhaleSurfing
(Post 2784942)
That one went way over your head didn’t it?
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Did SWA start flying here? Didn't see really anything about it in the news. We must not have missed a 737 load of SWA passengers all that much.
Day 2...still in business.. whew.. |
To everyone at SWA and HAL, you guys really are great! I sincerely mean that. Some of the best people and aviators I know work for both companies. I wish you all extremely profitable and long careers. You are not only always welcome on my jumpseat, it is a great chance to actually get to know you... I just wish the seat was more comfortable! I am confident the majority over here at Alaska feel this way! Cheers
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Do you think Railroad Engineers argue about which of their companies are the best?
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Originally Posted by av8tor55
(Post 2785023)
Do you think Railroad Engineers argue about which of their companies are the best?
Yes. It’s human nature. |
Originally Posted by av8tor55
(Post 2785023)
Do you think Railroad Engineers argue about which of their companies are the best?
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Originally Posted by Peacock
(Post 2785037)
Only once the Green New Deal is implemented and they’re competing for the best railroad to serve Hawaii
You win post of the day! Well done. [emoji481] |
Originally Posted by PNWFlyer
(Post 2784827)
That takes care of that.
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Originally Posted by at6d
(Post 2784848)
Uh, we are using 800’s for Hawaii. Just saying.
Uh, not MCAS... https://aviation-safety.net/wikibase/wiki.php?id=219098 |
Correct.
That is EMAS, which works even if the AOA probe is busted. |
Originally Posted by at6d
(Post 2785194)
Correct.
That is EMAS, which works even if the AOA probe is busted. Were you the one who tested it in Burbank? [emoji12] |
nope!
Filler |
Originally Posted by fuzzball
(Post 2783990)
Sorry, the above numbers are wrong. The ATSB loan was $40 million in 2003 and the net loss was $43 million.
So that was a $83 million deficit year (on revenue of, what 200M?) and management's hail mary was the merger. What happened next? 2004 bankruptcy, Banmiller, etc. I say again: With the merger, none of our friends from AQ would be in the left seat of an A330 deciding where they're having ramen in Osaka tonight. So please don't describe the few wise men who organized against the merger as having been fuelled by hate, they were looking two moves ahead and wanted at least one local carrier to survive. Heck, as a newish guy I sorta thought the merger made sense, but when the numbers became available there was no ignoring the facts. As for whether everyone's better off now, well, Hawaiian folks ended up with a lot more seniority than Aloha folks who had to start over in 2008. Kudos to Hawaiian for hiring so many, but when you have people who were at Aloha 20+ years starting over as year 1 FO's it’s clearly one-sided |
Originally Posted by av8tor55
(Post 2785201)
Were you the one who tested it in Burbank? [emoji12]
https://aviation-safety.net/database/record.php?id=20001223-0 |
Originally Posted by Opakapaka
(Post 2785615)
Hawaiian's later opposition to the merger had nothing to do with ATSB or losses as both airlines were bleeding. The primary reason was based on Hawaiian's opposition to Greg Brenneman and TurnWorks. Aloha wanted Brenneman. Hawaiian wanted their managers in charge of the merged airline.
As for whether everyone's better off now, well, Hawaiian folks ended up with a lot more seniority than Aloha folks who had to start over in 2008. Kudos to Hawaiian for hiring so many, but when you have people who were at Aloha 20+ years starting over as year 1 FO's it’s clearly one-sided https://newsroom.hawaiianairlines.co...around-in-2003 Exactly one airline was bleeding cash, and that's not my opinion, that's the opinion of the DOT and the SEC. If you were on the Hawaiian BOD, would you let the managers who had created a smoking crater out of a once great airline slide over and manage yours? I didn't think so. 40 year old -200s and a couple of -700s and losing 80+million to an all-new fleet and running a profit post 9/11? They'd have been sued for lack of fiduciary responsibility to protect their shareholders. Honolulu Star-Bulletin Business Scroll down to the 2003 stat: Aloha Airlines: From beginning to bankruptcy | The Honolulu Advertiser | Hawaii's Newspaper Signing out on this one. You're forcing me to relive sad memories about friends going through hard times, but I couldn't sit here and let you misinform people unfamiliar with the historical facts. |
Time to Jump ship from Hawaiian?
Jeez H. Crimey!
OK. Aloha went out of business. Guys. IM SORRY. Over Half the HAL seniority list was NOT around when that happened. I would also like to add that some of the best captains that I’ve flown with here, are former Aloha guys. Can we F-ing drop it now? It’s over. Simple math. One carrier survived, the other didn’t. 99.9% of the time, the non-surviving carriers pilots if they get jobs, get HIRED at the other carrier at the bottom. It was not a merger. Really Opakapaka... You have to go back almost 20 years to find ONE incident? Word on the street is that the FAA is considering re-naming the EMAS to “SWAMAS”. Not really an apples to apples comparison there. [/sarcasm] ;-) Come on guys, put the hard feelings down. Seriously. I love you Aloha guys, you are awesome. Remember, over half of the seniority list was not on property when all of that crap happened. LET GO... |
Originally Posted by fuzzball
(Post 2785700)
The problem with ignoring facts when you say things is that you lose all credibility. Please explain to the audience how a $77 million dollar profit can be described as "bleeding?"
https://newsroom.hawaiianairlines.co...around-in-2003 Exactly one airline was bleeding cash, and that's not my opinion, that's the opinion of the DOT and the SEC. If you were on the Hawaiian BOD, would you let the managers who had created a smoking crater out of a once great airline slide over and manage yours? I didn't think so. 40 year old -200s and a couple of -700s and losing 80+million to an all-new fleet and running a profit post 9/11? They'd have been sued for lack of fiduciary responsibility to protect their shareholders. Honolulu Star-Bulletin Business Scroll down to the 2003 stat: Aloha Airlines: From beginning to bankruptcy | The Honolulu Advertiser | Hawaii's Newspaper Signing out on this one. You're forcing me to relive sad memories about friends going through hard times, but I couldn't sit here and let you misinform people unfamiliar with the historical facts. Hawaiian most recently went into Chapter 11 in March 2003. Why would a profitable airline go into Chapter 11? Aloha’s first bankruptcy happened in December 2004. And the objection wasn’t that Zander wanted to run the combined airline, but rather Greg Brenneman who along with Gordon Bethune was instrumental in turning Continental around. In March 2003, Hawaiian Airlines filed for Chapter 11 bankruptcy protection for the second time in its history. The airline continued its normal operations, and at the time was overdue for $4.5 million worth of payments to the pilots' pension plan. Within the company, it was suggested that the plan be terminated. We were also hiring furloughed Hawaiian pilots at Aloha. Why were they furloughed if they were so well off? And no, they don’t have a monopoly on the sad times in that period. |
Originally Posted by Hawaiian 5O
(Post 2785708)
Jeez H. Crimey!
OK. Aloha went out of business. Guys. IM SORRY. Over Half the HAL seniority list was NOT around when that happened. I would also like to add that some of the best captains that I’ve flown with here, are former Aloha guys. Can we F-ing drop it now? It’s over. Simple math. One carrier survived, the other didn’t. 99.9% of the time, the non-surviving carriers pilots if they get jobs, get HIRED at the other carrier at the bottom. It was not a merger. Really Opakapaka... You have to go back almost 20 years to find ONE incident? Word on the street is that the FAA is considering re-naming the EMAS to “SWAMAS”. Not really an apples to apples comparison there. Come on guys, put the hard feelings down. Seriously. I love you Aloha guys, you are awesome. Remember, over half of the seniority list was not on property when all of that crap happened. LET GO... Word on the street is that the FAA is considering re-naming the EMAS to “SWAMAS” I posted that link cause someone posted the BUR incident. As for the 150 AQ pilots hired since AQ’s demise I’m very happy they landed on their feet as well as I did. I know everyone of them. If you look back at my earlier posts I mentioned we can all exist. It seems some thin skinned guys got their panties a bit wet over the pic in Oak ops. We all love the airline we fly for and that I would expect. But dude if you’re gonna lay one out on me, do the same for your Bro Fuzzball too. Ok I’m exhausted. Time for a beverage 🥃. Cheers |
Originally Posted by Opakapaka
(Post 2785712)
Hawaiian most recently went into Chapter 11 in March 2003. Why would a profitable airline go into Chapter 11? Why were they furloughed if they were so well off? And no, they don’t have a monopoly on the sad times in that period. 1) That's exactly what the bankruptcy judge asked right before he, for the first time in US history, removed a sitting CEO from his position. Should you choose to avail yourself of news sources, you'll find it right there. It was publicly described as a stunt to renegotiate 767 leases with Boeing and failed, hence John Adams' removel from the company and getting sued by the SEC. 2) Because 3-1=2. 16 DC-10s at three pilots per at 6.5 crews per = 312. Same math for 767 = 208. Unless math is something else you don't believe in, 300-200=100 furloughs. I can't believe I had to sign back on to explain this. |
Originally Posted by Opakapaka
(Post 2785727)
Whoa. Are you really any different than me?
Word on the street is that the FAA is considering re-naming the EMAS to “SWAMAS” -snip- Ok I’m exhausted. Time for a beverage [emoji1634]. Cheers Dude... You missed my [/sarcasm]. ;-) All good. It’s too easy to take these posts to seriously. Have one for me. I can’t, have to fly. Catch you on an overnight sometime. Cheers. [emoji481] |
Originally Posted by Hawaiian 5O
(Post 2785825)
Dude... You missed my [/sarcasm]. ;-)
All good. It’s too easy to take these posts to seriously. Have one for me. I can’t, have to fly. Catch you on an overnight sometime. Cheers. [emoji481] |
SW guy here. I honestly don’t think Hawaiian has anything to worry about. I’ve jumped on you guys several times over the past 10 years and it’s always been a great experience with a great product. I think customers do care about the overall experience and on board amenities. Jumped in the flight deck end of November and while the crews had questions about our plans, they were all very welcoming. The gate agents were a little cold, but I guess that’s to be expected.
My only complaint is the jumpseat listing procedure. Showed up at the gate to head to SMF and was told she couldn’t do it and I sprinted 1/2 mile to the other terminal to get it done. Any hope on this changing in the future? Even online listing would be beneficial. One can hope. Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk |
Originally Posted by sMFer
(Post 2785893)
My only complaint is the jumpseat listing procedure. Showed up at the gate to head to SMF and was told she couldn’t do it and I sprinted 1/2 mile to the other terminal to get it done. Any hope on this changing in the future? Even online listing would be beneficial. One can hope.
Sorry. I PROMISE YOU that our JS committee is trying to get this fixed. They “get it”. Like with everything else though, things out here move at the speed of smell. Don’t hold your breath. If we pilots had our way, this would’ve been fixed years ago. Hang in there. I’ve ridden on you guys also several times in the past. It’s been an awesome experience. Rivalry aside, you guys are ALWAYS welcome on the JS here!! |
Originally Posted by Hawaiian 5O
(Post 2786008)
Sorry. I PROMISE YOU that our JS committee is trying to get this fixed. They “get it”.
Like with everything else though, things out here move at the speed of smell. Don’t hold your breath. If we pilots had our way, this would’ve been fixed years ago. Hang in there. I’ve ridden on you guys also several times in the past. It’s been an awesome experience. Rivalry aside, you guys are ALWAYS welcome on the JS here!! |
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