Horizon?
12-05-2009 | 03:54 PM
#91
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 473
Likes: 0
From: ERJ145 Captain
Clear up the air a bit.
When I started out the term "regional" in regards to the airlines did not exist. There were "commuters" but no one wanted to work there. Like everyone else my goal was to fly for a "major" airline. Never for a commuter if I could help it. Life for a major airline pilot is vastly different from that of a regional pilot. Pay is more than double what a regional pilot earns. They work less and have much better benefits. Besides that legacy pilots have easier lives and a better work experience.
After a restful (not) night at a trashy truck stop grade hotel in a podunk town a regional pilot commonly starts the day at 3:30AM for a 4:30 show time and a 5:00AM departure. After 14 hours of scheduled duty time, three airplane swaps, two airport fast food meals the regional pilot is finally able to stand in the rain awaiting the van ride to the next crummy hotel where the bed is hard and truckers yell obscenities at prostitutes in the parking lot all night. Regional turboprop pilots are stuck in the weather all day between two pounding propellers. Major airline pilots do not fly 9 leg days, climb to FL 350, and rarely had to show before 7:00AM
As a major (now known as legacy) airline pilot you were building towards a better life. They stay in nicer hotels, have enough per diem to buy better meals and are even fed in flight. They fly much fewer legs and often only have to pre-flight a plane once a day. Legacy plots go home to nice neighborhoods and park in the driveway of a home that they own. Their spouses can afford to stay at home if they wish. Legacy pilots can fly more credit hours in a day since the leg lengths are longer and have better opportunity for more time off.
Regional pilots wear the same uniforms as legacy guys and have a similar job but their lives are very much not the same. A regional pilot lives in trailer parks and wish they were mailmen. I always wanted something better and was not willing to cut my future short merely because I was able to fly a plane everyday.
After a restful (not) night at a trashy truck stop grade hotel in a podunk town a regional pilot commonly starts the day at 3:30AM for a 4:30 show time and a 5:00AM departure. After 14 hours of scheduled duty time, three airplane swaps, two airport fast food meals the regional pilot is finally able to stand in the rain awaiting the van ride to the next crummy hotel where the bed is hard and truckers yell obscenities at prostitutes in the parking lot all night. Regional turboprop pilots are stuck in the weather all day between two pounding propellers. Major airline pilots do not fly 9 leg days, climb to FL 350, and rarely had to show before 7:00AM
As a major (now known as legacy) airline pilot you were building towards a better life. They stay in nicer hotels, have enough per diem to buy better meals and are even fed in flight. They fly much fewer legs and often only have to pre-flight a plane once a day. Legacy plots go home to nice neighborhoods and park in the driveway of a home that they own. Their spouses can afford to stay at home if they wish. Legacy pilots can fly more credit hours in a day since the leg lengths are longer and have better opportunity for more time off.
Regional pilots wear the same uniforms as legacy guys and have a similar job but their lives are very much not the same. A regional pilot lives in trailer parks and wish they were mailmen. I always wanted something better and was not willing to cut my future short merely because I was able to fly a plane everyday.
What some see as road blocks other see as the necessary elements of a full and happy life. Home, friends, hobbies, family, a wife and children are all important essentials I was not willing to compromise.
I have seen other pilots intentionally avoid finding a spouse move across the country in purist of a slightly better job and then wonder why at 40 they are not married and still do not own a house.
It is one of my main complaints about the profession. There is little room left for a pilot to develop a healthy life outside of the job. As pilots we are expected to drop everything and drag the family all over the continent following the career. There is not enough pay nor enough time off.
In the past a young pilot would get hired at their dream company while still young enough to endure the hardships. By the time the wife and kids came along hopefully they were senior enough to be past all the sacrifices. Now they just keep coming for decades.
It almost seems like a guy now has to be single to make this career work.
Skyhigh
I have seen other pilots intentionally avoid finding a spouse move across the country in purist of a slightly better job and then wonder why at 40 they are not married and still do not own a house.
It is one of my main complaints about the profession. There is little room left for a pilot to develop a healthy life outside of the job. As pilots we are expected to drop everything and drag the family all over the continent following the career. There is not enough pay nor enough time off.
In the past a young pilot would get hired at their dream company while still young enough to endure the hardships. By the time the wife and kids came along hopefully they were senior enough to be past all the sacrifices. Now they just keep coming for decades.
It almost seems like a guy now has to be single to make this career work.
Skyhigh
I am a 4 year F/O at a regional with a good contract and good management/labor relations, and I have never:
- Spent the night at a truck-stop motel.
- Had 9 leg days.
- Had constant wake up calls at 3:30am.
- Not been able to afford a place to live.
- Not been able to eat a good meal.
- Payed 150K for college and ratings.
- and I did not start out in my early 20's.
On the contrary:
- My 1st year I made $28K, and have averaged $50K since, and I only fly about half a year when you take into account days off and vacation.
- Average 3 legs a day (at FL350 like the guys at the majors).
- Have a hotel committee that assures that we have a minimum standard for our hotels and most are very nice.
- Even on a bad paring (which is not common) I'll get up at 4:30-5:00am one or two days, and the rest are normal time shows.
- I worked full time while building my time so I didn't have to suffer, sure it took longer, but I always had a nice bed and a warm meal while CFI'ing on the side.
- I started in my 30's (so no it's not a young man's game only).
- Only paid about $55K for degree and ratings. I did a part 61 school and went to a state university, even today it can be done for less than $70K, so I'm not sure where you got $150K from.
The point is simple, it's a different world and a different experience for everyone. Mine is going well so far, maybe not as I planned, but certainly not off track either, and I am usually happier than my CPA buddies, and get to travel around the world or simply have a life with a lot more ease than the 9-5 guys. As you said, it's all about perspective, I'm happy. You chose a 150 and a big family, and you're happy, let's all be happy together and respect each other's views.
goaround
12-06-2009 | 09:01 PM
#93
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Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 30
Likes: 0
Since this thread is about horizon though, those poor guys do 5-8 legs a day, stay in some nice hotels and others seedy roach joints (YKM, the former LMT, etc), and constantly have 4 and 5 am wake up calls (usually after staying up until 1 am earlier in the trip)
12-07-2009 | 07:43 AM
#94
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 443
Likes: 0
Not to mention the unpaid hanger pick ups and drop offs at O'dark 30. Oh and not getting paid block or better, so when you have an EDCT for SFO due to flow you aren't getting paid for the extra hour you are flying. I know many guys that made more on first year pay at Skywest ($19/hr) than on first year pay at QX.
03-12-2010 | 04:34 PM
#99
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Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 284
Likes: 10
From: Taking up space
Having received that update and recommendation, we'll begin the process of recalling 12 pilots and requalifying six downgraded Q400 CAs. The Chief Pilot’s Office will begin making notifications and assigning training dates beginning next week.
03-12-2010 | 05:02 PM
#100
Line Holder
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 707
Likes: 19
From: Furloughed
I was hoping for 10-15 and that is a good start but lets see them bump that number up by a few more. There may be a light at the end of the tunnel. BTW Gene was up in SEA talking with the AS VP of FLt ops today. <- so a friend told me.
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