Originally Posted by PasserOGas

Maybe get bought by a real airline in BK

Originally Posted by BeatNavy

I flew with 3 captains in the last 3 days. 2 had no lanyard. All wanted to single engine taxi in JFK and other snowy/icy places. All wanted to not write stuff up or wait until back in JFK to do it. One extended me without consulting me (he was fresh, I wasn’t). That cost me a lot of money, he got his though. None had read the union email. All did stand up PAs, 2 of which gave HORRIBLE and embarrassing comedy routines to already delayed and disgruntled pax. Nails on a chalkboard. All were on VDAs. One is good buddies with a fairly prominent union guy and proudly said he supports the union, had the grip and lanyard, but did EVERYTHING the union said not to do. After the first day I asked if he read the union email..he said no. He got to hear all about it and the P2P call. I showed him the email. He seemed surprised about the things the union wants us to do, like be safe and legal and write stuff up, not make excess announcements, and do...you know, pilot stuff. He ironically also had failed to do a lot of pilot stuff, but made sure his stand up was done. It’s so hard as an FO not only trying to mold to each different captain, but to stand up to them when they say “let’s write it up later or not at all. You cool with that?” Or “we will go out on one, it’s not that bad out.” One said his timeline for being in a dispute is Jan 31st if we don’t get anywhere with our next two sessions. I reminded him that Jan 1st was when our union leaders made it clear we are in a labor dispute. I lost a lot of faith in this pilot group this weekend. But hopefully enough of us can educate those who don’t read union email and message boards. Shocking how out of the loop some of these guys are. It’s only your job, future, and potential boost to pay/retirement/benefits that’s at stake.

I really hope the union starts giving out flyers to put in flight decks to educate the ignorant.

Originally Posted by hilltopflyer

You are allowed to stand up for SOP to cpts. If it isn't safe to taxi single engine stand up and voice it. Even if the cpt extends without consulting, you can call out. Cpt doesn't control everything in the cockpit (especially the fo)

Originally Posted by BeatNavy

Well yeah, and I did, but it made/makes for an awkward cockpit climate (and degradation of CRM if you want to go there) after laying down the law with a captain. It is supposed to be the Captain making the safe and prudent decisions and not being overridden by a subordinate. It’s unsat when almost all my captains get plssed when I ask them to write stuff up. Then they try to pressure me to accept doing it later. I know for a fact it happens all the time. I’ve talked to friends and captains about it. No way are the small writeups I find not found by others. They are just overlooked because they are minor. The union (and company and FAA) has said it is a legal requirement to write it up, no matter how small. Why a CA would try to pressure FOs to accept anything less is beyond me, in (or not in) a labor dispute. As for the extension...I wasn’t fatigued. That’s not the point. Extensions aren’t fatigue calls. They are purely optional regardless of fatigue level. No fatigue is required. So he could have consulted me and known that I didn’t want to extend.

Originally Posted by BeatNavy

Well yeah, and I did, but it made/makes for an awkward cockpit climate (and degradation of CRM if you want to go there) after laying down the law with a captain. It is supposed to be the Captain making the safe and prudent decisions and not being overridden by a subordinate. It’s unsat when almost all my captains get plssed when I ask them to write stuff up. Then they try to pressure me to accept doing it later. I know for a fact it happens all the time. I’ve talked to friends and captains about it. No way are the small writeups I find not found by others. They are just overlooked because they are minor. The union (and company and FAA) has said it is a legal requirement to write it up, no matter how small. Why a CA would try to pressure FOs to accept anything less is beyond me, in (or not in) a labor dispute. As for the extension...I wasn’t fatigued. That’s not the point. Extensions aren’t fatigue calls. They are purely optional regardless of fatigue level. No fatigue is required. So he could have consulted me and known that I didn’t want to extend.

Originally Posted by Bigapplepilot

Please clear this up for me. A captain can agree to extend the FO. If the FO agrees, cool. It was my understanding that if the FO says he/she will not extend AGAINST the captain’s wish, that FO must file a fatigue report. Am I wrong? Because if no fatigue report is required from the FO, and it is simply optional for the FO to extend, than why ask the captain about the FOs extension at all? Just ask the FO.

Originally Posted by BeatNavy

You are correct. PIC and carrier are the approval authority to extend either/both crew members. If the PIC doesn’t concur to an extension for either crewmember, it’s done and over with. Company can’t say anything. No fatigue report required. If Captain concurs, but the FO does not concur because he believes he is not fit to fly, a fatigue report must be filled out. This can be avoided by the captain not concuring in the first place and talking to the FO, hence me getting pssed when I returned from the walk around and my Captain said “hey the company called and asked how you were doing and if I’d agree to extend you, so I did. Hope that’s cool.”