Scope
06-29-2018, 04:31 AM
#101
The REAL Bluedriver
Joined APC: Sep 2011
Position: Airbus Capt
Posts: 6,880
Our NC and union are very intelligent. They know, as ***SWA know*******, that domestic codeshare is an important issue.
Our scope opening position would be to copy SWA, the true industry leader in scope.
The question you should be asking yourselves is "WHY did management dig in their heels and refuse domestic codeshare restrictions"?.
That should tell you how important it is to management.
Our scope opening position would be to copy SWA, the true industry leader in scope.
The question you should be asking yourselves is "WHY did management dig in their heels and refuse domestic codeshare restrictions"?.
That should tell you how important it is to management.
06-29-2018, 04:33 AM
#102
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2008
Position: B6
Posts: 1,047
Originally Posted by Bozo the pilot
When has a company not tried to limit everything a pilot group has asked for? Why would they let us eliminate it completely? We state our desire, they state their limits. Negotiations.
My point about the length of a 100% restrictive contract is that its not possible. We negotiate to a point where we feel we get enough restriction or at least some restriction and then we move on to the other parts of Scope like FFD/M&A etc. Could we have stipulated more of a growth number? Sure. As well we could have gotten pay higher/benefits and profit sharing. I am okay with the section including the Codesharing language.
I see why you want elimination of codeshares just like SWA, but do you want their work rules. At some point you have to accept the give and take of the process.
In respect BN.
My point about the length of a 100% restrictive contract is that its not possible. We negotiate to a point where we feel we get enough restriction or at least some restriction and then we move on to the other parts of Scope like FFD/M&A etc. Could we have stipulated more of a growth number? Sure. As well we could have gotten pay higher/benefits and profit sharing. I am okay with the section including the Codesharing language.
I see why you want elimination of codeshares just like SWA, but do you want their work rules. At some point you have to accept the give and take of the process.
In respect BN.
There should be no excuse.
06-29-2018, 04:40 AM
#103
The REAL Bluedriver
Joined APC: Sep 2011
Position: Airbus Capt
Posts: 6,880
Originally Posted by Bozo the pilot
When has a company not tried to limit everything a pilot group has asked for? ****Why would they let us eliminate it completely?***** We state our desire, they state their limits. Negotiations.
My point about the length of a 100% restrictive contract is that its not possible. We negotiate to a point where we feel we get enough restriction or at least some restriction and then we move on to the other parts of Scope like FFD/M&A etc. Could we have stipulated more of a growth number? Sure. As well we could have gotten pay higher/benefits and profit sharing. I am okay with the section including the Codesharing language.
I see why you want elimination of codeshares just like SWA, but do you want their work rules. At some point you have to accept the give and take of the process.
In respect BN.
My point about the length of a 100% restrictive contract is that its not possible. We negotiate to a point where we feel we get enough restriction or at least some restriction and then we move on to the other parts of Scope like FFD/M&A etc. Could we have stipulated more of a growth number? Sure. As well we could have gotten pay higher/benefits and profit sharing. I am okay with the section including the Codesharing language.
I see why you want elimination of codeshares just like SWA, but do you want their work rules. At some point you have to accept the give and take of the process.
In respect BN.
We went in as a union absolutely guns blazing on healthcare improvements and profit sharing improvements. We failed, because the company didn't want to separate us from the other work groups because it would show other work groups that they need to unionize to get good benefits. They (the company) will absolutely not give what they hold sacred.
So, why did they fold like a wet blanket on RJs but build a fortress around domestic codeshare?
I've been trying to explain it....
06-29-2018, 04:51 AM
#104
The REAL Bluedriver
Joined APC: Sep 2011
Position: Airbus Capt
Posts: 6,880
Originally Posted by hyperboy
The videos, backed up by...........reading the contract, and FAQ's, contract comparison, and eventually a roadshow have, will and have been very informative. The information is ALL there you just have to do your part. I hope more show the importance of your vote and your career than what your fellow pilot tells you in the cockpit, and what fellow pilots did not do by showing support (for the process) at the last union meeting where you can express your opinion and thoughts as constituents.
There should be no excuse.
There should be no excuse.
06-29-2018, 05:00 AM
#105
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: May 2013
Posts: 2,594
Originally Posted by Bluedriver
Your own argument fails itself. They let us scope out RJs completely! So why did they stand so strong on domestic codesharing?
We went in as a union absolutely guns blazing on healthcare improvements and profit sharing improvements. We failed, because the company didn't want to separate us from the other work groups because it would show other work groups that they need to unionize to get good benefits. They (the company) will absolutely not give what they hold sacred.
So, why did they fold like a wet blanket on RJs but build a fortress around domestic codeshare?
I've been trying to explain it....
We went in as a union absolutely guns blazing on healthcare improvements and profit sharing improvements. We failed, because the company didn't want to separate us from the other work groups because it would show other work groups that they need to unionize to get good benefits. They (the company) will absolutely not give what they hold sacred.
So, why did they fold like a wet blanket on RJs but build a fortress around domestic codeshare?
I've been trying to explain it....
06-29-2018, 05:13 AM
#106
The REAL Bluedriver
Joined APC: Sep 2011
Position: Airbus Capt
Posts: 6,880
Originally Posted by Bozo the pilot
So its SWA or nothing for you- thanks for clarifying.
I'M NOT SAYING VOTE NO.
I may very well end up holding my nose and voting YES.
But, I do want us all to know what is likely coming in the future.
That's all Bozo. I know you desperately want this to pass, so you lash out at ANY criticism.
For me, this is just a warning, not a NO campaign.
06-29-2018, 05:20 AM
#107
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: May 2013
Posts: 2,594
Originally Posted by Bluedriver
Don't be a moron.
I'M NOT SAYING VOTE NO.
I may very well end up holding my nose and voting YES.
But, I do want us all to know what is likely coming in the future.
That's all Bozo. I know you desperately want this to pass, so you lash out at ANY criticism.
For me, this is just a warning, not a NO campaign.
I'M NOT SAYING VOTE NO.
I may very well end up holding my nose and voting YES.
But, I do want us all to know what is likely coming in the future.
That's all Bozo. I know you desperately want this to pass, so you lash out at ANY criticism.
For me, this is just a warning, not a NO campaign.
Part of me wants to see how a rejection would play out, and Ive stated that before.
When all you have left is name-calling and rage, your childish approach to people is apparent.
Monitor your blood pressure BD, its peaking.
Lots of luck man.
06-29-2018, 05:22 AM
#108
The REAL Bluedriver
Joined APC: Sep 2011
Position: Airbus Capt
Posts: 6,880
Originally Posted by Bozo the pilot
I havent called you names and it appears as though you're the one lashing out BD.
Part of me wants to see how a rejection would play out, and Ive stated that before.
When all you have left is name-calling and rage, your childish approach to people is apparent.
Monitor your blood pressure BD, its peaking.
Lots of luck man.
Part of me wants to see how a rejection would play out, and Ive stated that before.
When all you have left is name-calling and rage, your childish approach to people is apparent.
Monitor your blood pressure BD, its peaking.
Lots of luck man.
06-29-2018, 05:29 AM
#109
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: May 2013
Posts: 2,594
Originally Posted by Bluedriver
I was just telling you what NOT to be.
And in fairness, we all do at times.
Good luck to ya.
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