Don't Follow Your Passion
03-28-2015, 06:39 PM
#161
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Sep 2007
Position: 777 Captain in Training
Posts: 1,457
Originally Posted by JamesNoBrakes
To be fair, you are expecting people to make critical decisions about their future before they go to school to learn how to critically think. Kind of doesn't make sense, right? Once they commit they start racking up the bills, but by the time most of them realize the real stagnation in the industry, the real rungs of the ladder they have to climb, the real time it may take and the real chances of getting where they want, it is long after they've committed. I'm not going to claim that these kids are overtly preyed upon, but the lack of real information on which to make a decision and their current level of cognitive and critical thinking makes the whole "you knew what you were getting into" a little far-fetched.
Then I guess you should not be able to volunteer to enlist in the military at 18 .
03-28-2015, 09:15 PM
#162
Self Employed.
Thread Starter
Joined APC: May 2005
Position: Corporate Pilot
Posts: 7,119
Irony Right?
Originally Posted by HIFLYR
Then I guess you should not be able to volunteer to enlist in the military at 18 .
A joke... I get it. I wish I could find the guy who put the 18 year old kid in charge of my future.
SkyHigh
03-28-2015, 09:37 PM
#163
Self Employed.
Thread Starter
Joined APC: May 2005
Position: Corporate Pilot
Posts: 7,119
Young People Are Not Given All the Facts
I encounter young people who are embarking on aviation careers all the time. Most assume that they will be hired by SWA within a few years of graduation. They must believe that because when the student loans hit in full force there is no other rational path that leads to survival. Self delusion and misinformation is crucial to starting training for an airline career these days.
I tell every one of them to come onto APC to read about real airline pilots and most will not. Seems as though they wish to preserve their passion filled stupor unto their doom. Growing up and choosing a pragmatic career path is not all that attractive. Playing peter pan airline pilot in college as the debt builds is more fun. We did not have such a resource when I was in college. If there was I would be an accountant. What we had was a string of 25 year old alumni stopping by the university in legacy airline uniforms to give short speeches about how great their life was with TWA and then sped off in a new corvette.
Over the last ten years the university ceased uncensored airline speakers. Not only had they become dark and depressing but one UAL captain almost had the entire student body running for the door. New students are bombarded with propaganda and a false message to sell seats in the program. What they could use is a dose of the truth but it seems most are complicit in the sting. The silver lining is that the costs are becoming so outrageous and news stories increasingly prolific regarding the truth about pilot wages that even the most starry eyed of dreamers are being shocked sober upon receiving their first training bill. One poor guy thought that tuition covered flight training too.
Skyhigh
I tell every one of them to come onto APC to read about real airline pilots and most will not. Seems as though they wish to preserve their passion filled stupor unto their doom. Growing up and choosing a pragmatic career path is not all that attractive. Playing peter pan airline pilot in college as the debt builds is more fun. We did not have such a resource when I was in college. If there was I would be an accountant. What we had was a string of 25 year old alumni stopping by the university in legacy airline uniforms to give short speeches about how great their life was with TWA and then sped off in a new corvette.
Over the last ten years the university ceased uncensored airline speakers. Not only had they become dark and depressing but one UAL captain almost had the entire student body running for the door. New students are bombarded with propaganda and a false message to sell seats in the program. What they could use is a dose of the truth but it seems most are complicit in the sting. The silver lining is that the costs are becoming so outrageous and news stories increasingly prolific regarding the truth about pilot wages that even the most starry eyed of dreamers are being shocked sober upon receiving their first training bill. One poor guy thought that tuition covered flight training too.
Skyhigh
03-29-2015, 07:42 AM
#164
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Sep 2007
Position: 777 Captain in Training
Posts: 1,457
Sky,
I am glad your change worked out for you. Aviation has been a great experience for me and a good living. I am 52 and even before the internet when I was 18 I knew not to charge a large amount of money. I would say there is NO CAREER that you can count on, there are people in all professions that do not make it in life. I am different than many as I worked my way thru college, flight training and building time to the tune of over 10 yrs before being hired by my company. I would say anyone who charges a large sum of money for any career is taking a huge chance it will work out. Critical thinking my but, for many in the I want it now crowd it's the chance they take for the fast track i.e. Aviation colleges or degrees.
I am glad your change worked out for you. Aviation has been a great experience for me and a good living. I am 52 and even before the internet when I was 18 I knew not to charge a large amount of money. I would say there is NO CAREER that you can count on, there are people in all professions that do not make it in life. I am different than many as I worked my way thru college, flight training and building time to the tune of over 10 yrs before being hired by my company. I would say anyone who charges a large sum of money for any career is taking a huge chance it will work out. Critical thinking my but, for many in the I want it now crowd it's the chance they take for the fast track i.e. Aviation colleges or degrees.
03-29-2015, 07:45 AM
#165
Moderator
Joined APC: May 2006
Position: ATP, CFI etc.
Posts: 6,056
Sky, if you were to collect your views, history, and so forth and made it into a not-for-profit website I think we could regularly share it here. The benefit would be getting newbies up to speed on what they face in the airline industry, as your own sincere viewpoint on it. I had my own website at one point (for other pusposes) and it was around $100 a year, based on the Weebly platform. If you take my suggestion, please try and keep the hyperbole to a minimum. Unadorned facts speak louder than rhetoric. Here's an example:
The Truth About the Profession - Home
The Truth About the Profession - Home
03-29-2015, 08:51 AM
#166
Self Employed.
Thread Starter
Joined APC: May 2005
Position: Corporate Pilot
Posts: 7,119
Hey Thanks Buddy
Originally Posted by Cubdriver
Sky, if you were to collect your views, history, and so forth and made it into a not-for-profit website I think we could regularly share it here. The benefit would be getting newbies up to speed on what they face in the airline industry, as your own sincere viewpoint on it. I had my own website at one point (for other pusposes) and it was around $100 a year, based on the Weebly platform. If you take my suggestion, please try and keep the hyperbole to a minimum. Unadorned facts speak louder than rhetoric. Here's an example:
The Truth About the Profession - Home
The Truth About the Profession - Home
Skyhigh
03-29-2015, 09:03 AM
#167
Self Employed.
Thread Starter
Joined APC: May 2005
Position: Corporate Pilot
Posts: 7,119
Same
Originally Posted by HIFLYR
Sky,
I am glad your change worked out for you. Aviation has been a great experience for me and a good living. I am 52 and even before the internet when I was 18 I knew not to charge a large amount of money. I would say there is NO CAREER that you can count on, there are people in all professions that do not make it in life. I am different than many as I worked my way thru college, flight training and building time to the tune of over 10 yrs before being hired by my company. I would say anyone who charges a large sum of money for any career is taking a huge chance it will work out. Critical thinking my but, for many in the I want it now crowd it's the chance they take for the fast track i.e. Aviation colleges or degrees.
I am glad your change worked out for you. Aviation has been a great experience for me and a good living. I am 52 and even before the internet when I was 18 I knew not to charge a large amount of money. I would say there is NO CAREER that you can count on, there are people in all professions that do not make it in life. I am different than many as I worked my way thru college, flight training and building time to the tune of over 10 yrs before being hired by my company. I would say anyone who charges a large sum of money for any career is taking a huge chance it will work out. Critical thinking my but, for many in the I want it now crowd it's the chance they take for the fast track i.e. Aviation colleges or degrees.
I also worked my way through college and flight school but am a few years younger then you. Things changed around 1988 before I was able to graduate. Anyone who was able to secure a position before that year seems to be alright. Those who have followed are suffering an increasingly worse situation as the years go on. I am glad that things worked out for you however your experiences have little relevance to pilots today.
Look to the future and attempt to project the trajectory of where aviation is headed to gain a glimpse of the future not the past. Tesla Motors claims to have a self driving car on the market this summer awaiting software to activate that ability in the near future. It seems to me that it is highly unlikely that an 18 year old pilot today will still be able to manually fly a transport jet in 20 years. The latest A320 crash makes another case for automated or ground controlled transport category planes.
China is building a huge pilot factory system with the goal of global commercial aviation dominance through flooding the market with cheap obedient hotel room sharing automation pilots. See: China Airborne by James Fallows.
Point is: We are all very happy that you have enjoyed such a great time in aviation however that experience does not translate very well into the future.
Skyhigh
03-29-2015, 09:28 AM
#168
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2008
Position: FAA 'Flight Check'
Posts: 13,837
Originally Posted by SkyHigh
The latest A320 crash makes another case for automated or ground controlled transport category planes.
Point is: We are all very happy that you have enjoyed such a great time in aviation however that experience does not translate very well into the future.
03-29-2015, 12:57 PM
#170
Disinterested Third Party
Joined APC: Jun 2012
Posts: 6,025
Originally Posted by SkyHigh
I also worked my way through college and flight school but am a few years younger then you. Things changed around 1988 before I was able to graduate. Anyone who was able to secure a position before that year seems to be alright. Those who have followed are suffering an increasingly worse situation as the years go on. I am glad that things worked out for you however your experiences have little relevance to pilots today.
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