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[Breeze] Airways
10-10-2021, 03:04 AM
#1852
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jan 2019
Posts: 105
Originally Posted by BobbyLeeSwagger
So you're not there to strike career gold getting a sub 100 seniority number at the next jetblue? I think that's that's true counter argument to the money, it's not having pleasant conversations with customers. If you want to stay because you think if it pans out you'll have it made, fine, that's your risk to take.. but don't act like everyone is shallow and your not because we think you deserve to be paid like a professional pilot. I mean with all that it has taken you to get where you are professionally, you're OK with them saying you dont deserve to get paid until you're rolling off the gate at a certain wheel speed? Don't you feel nickel and dimed?
Having said that, i'm realistic. If pay doesn't improve by year 2023 at a level commensurate with my flying experience, my clean record, education, etc, then yes, I will move on.
In the meantime, I am thoroughly enjoying it. Thanks for asking..
10-10-2021, 05:45 AM
#1853
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Aug 2005
Posts: 314
Originally Posted by NewCareer
Saying absolutely nothing about any of the arguments made in this thread….Earlier in this thread someone mention Flying the Line by George E. Hopkins. I wasn’t able to easily find an electronic version but did come across the podcast by ALPA which is an abridged retelling of the book and has allowed me to listen to this on my commute. And it’s free. Good for them for putting it out.
I am only through chapter 7 and it’s pretty fascinating especially if you’re into history. I can already see why it’s “required reading” and wish I had found this sooner!
In the interest of spreading the word for anyone who cares, here is the Apple link but it’s not only on Apple.
https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcas...e/id1451649159
And the website:
https://feed.podbean.com/alpa/feed.xml
Enjoy
I am only through chapter 7 and it’s pretty fascinating especially if you’re into history. I can already see why it’s “required reading” and wish I had found this sooner!
In the interest of spreading the word for anyone who cares, here is the Apple link but it’s not only on Apple.
https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcas...e/id1451649159
And the website:
https://feed.podbean.com/alpa/feed.xml
Enjoy
10-10-2021, 08:16 AM
#1854
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Aug 2014
Posts: 846
Originally Posted by 310skying
Allegiant is also the most profitable airline in the world for 2021.
He also jokes that Allegiant is the lowest paid, without acknowledging that when the contract was signed it was industry leading pay, and that Allegiant is once again looking to be the first out with a new contract in 2022 setting the bar for everyone else post pandemic.
airbus was shopping around some of breeze’s 220 to Allegiant last week since you guys can’t keep up with your delivery schedule.
He also jokes that Allegiant is the lowest paid, without acknowledging that when the contract was signed it was industry leading pay, and that Allegiant is once again looking to be the first out with a new contract in 2022 setting the bar for everyone else post pandemic.
airbus was shopping around some of breeze’s 220 to Allegiant last week since you guys can’t keep up with your delivery schedule.
You are right, it was industry leading for all of 6 or so months until Delta leaped over, and then United, American, Spirit, Jetblue and Frontier… A true industry leading contract would have been one that would have remained relevant with everyone else’s contract.
Allegiant may be negotiating now, but so is every other operator except for Spirit and Frontier who still have 1 and 2 years respectively remaining on their CBA’s.
So if Allegiant pulls the trigger first and only just tops the current end of contract rates others have, when everyone else pulls the trigger immediately after, they are still back at the bottom.
Here’s the difference though, instead of wishing ill on those pilots like everyone is doing on breeze pilots, I hope they get a true industry leading contract just like I would hope they would hope for Breeze pilots.
Riiiight. Except we have only increased our A220 order and our delivery schedule is maxed out by the current A220 production line in the US. The only delay in A220 deliveries came when they delayed the launch of the airline and that was accomplished by swapping delivery slots with JetBlue.
The only new plane Allegiant has ever taken delivery of was the end of the line A320CEO’s… your expecting me to believe they are looking at brand new planes that would be a second fleet type at that airline that are still at the beginning of the their production cycle?
10-10-2021, 11:18 AM
#1855
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2016
Position: CRJ FO
Posts: 193
So it’s ok for Allegiant to be the most profitable carrier at the expense of being the lowest paid A32x operator? - it’s been the most profitable carrier in America every year since the late 2000s including the year they had an industry leading contract.
You are right, it was industry leading for all of 6 or so months until Delta leaped over, and then United, American, Spirit, Jetblue and Frontier… A true industry leading contract would have been one that would have remained relevant…. By your logic Delta nor any other airline would have had an industry leading contract. They have all been leapfrogged, by Allegiant…
Allegiant may be negotiating now, but so is every other operator except for Spirit and Frontier who still have 1 and 2 years respectively remaining on their CBA’s.
So if Allegiant pulls the trigger first and only just tops the current end of contract rates others have, when everyone else pulls the trigger immediately after, they are still back at the bottom. Everyone may be negotiating, but only one airline is making actual cash flow to pay their pilots. Delta, United, SWA are all going to be looking for concessions because their balance sheets suck.
Riiiight. Except we have only increased our A220 order and our delivery schedule is maxed out by the current A220 production line in the US. The only delay in A220 deliveries came when they delayed the launch of the airline and that was accomplished by swapping delivery slots with JetBlue. IDK, all I know is airbus came to G4 (once again best balance sheet in the industry). G4 is looking at any planes they can get their hands on and doing 20% growth per year.
The only new plane Allegiant has ever taken delivery of was the end of the line A320CEO’s… your expecting me to believe they are looking at brand new planes that would be a second fleet type at that airline that are still at the beginning of the their production cycle? Do you know G4s CEO also owns an aircraft leasing company? Or that G4 has run 3 different fleets at the same time (md80, 757, a320).
You are right, it was industry leading for all of 6 or so months until Delta leaped over, and then United, American, Spirit, Jetblue and Frontier… A true industry leading contract would have been one that would have remained relevant…. By your logic Delta nor any other airline would have had an industry leading contract. They have all been leapfrogged, by Allegiant…
Allegiant may be negotiating now, but so is every other operator except for Spirit and Frontier who still have 1 and 2 years respectively remaining on their CBA’s.
So if Allegiant pulls the trigger first and only just tops the current end of contract rates others have, when everyone else pulls the trigger immediately after, they are still back at the bottom. Everyone may be negotiating, but only one airline is making actual cash flow to pay their pilots. Delta, United, SWA are all going to be looking for concessions because their balance sheets suck.
Riiiight. Except we have only increased our A220 order and our delivery schedule is maxed out by the current A220 production line in the US. The only delay in A220 deliveries came when they delayed the launch of the airline and that was accomplished by swapping delivery slots with JetBlue. IDK, all I know is airbus came to G4 (once again best balance sheet in the industry). G4 is looking at any planes they can get their hands on and doing 20% growth per year.
The only new plane Allegiant has ever taken delivery of was the end of the line A320CEO’s… your expecting me to believe they are looking at brand new planes that would be a second fleet type at that airline that are still at the beginning of the their production cycle? Do you know G4s CEO also owns an aircraft leasing company? Or that G4 has run 3 different fleets at the same time (md80, 757, a320).
10-11-2021, 07:40 AM
#1857
Prime Minister/Moderator
Joined APC: Jan 2006
Position: Engines Turn Or People Swim
Posts: 37,824
Originally Posted by 310skying
So it’s ok for Allegiant to be the most profitable carrier at the expense of being the lowest paid A32x operator? - [b]it’s been the most profitable carrier in America every year since the late 2000s including the year they had an industry leading contract.Or that G4 has run 3 different fleets at the same time (md80, 757, a320)
10-11-2021, 12:00 PM
#1858
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2016
Position: CRJ FO
Posts: 193
Originally Posted by rickair7777
G4 operates a niche business model, they succeed because they're smart enough to stay in their lane. Obviously if they try to compete directly with the bigs and expand into THEIR business model, it's going to be tough.
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