Ugly day at LGA
03-28-2024, 01:54 PM
#21
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2016
Posts: 129
Deleted to remove troll food
03-28-2024, 02:51 PM
#22
Strike averted!
Joined APC: Mar 2015
Position: B737
Posts: 3,647
I’ve flown with several of our senior female captains. All but one were skilled aviators. FWIW the LGA debacle was captained by a known quantity. There is still heartburn on the line from some of the captains I flew with. I recently flew with a newhire female that became so frazzled after a missed approach that for her the flight became….over. Anyway, not a DEI issue but a less than 2000 hours total time airmanship issue.
As a junior captain (9-year pay) I encourage our newhires to fly those approaches where we “earn the pay” so as to improve that airmanship and experience, but again somewhere we need to draw the line.
Im also on the conservative gas side—I’m surprised that they had the gas for two attempts!
As a junior captain (9-year pay) I encourage our newhires to fly those approaches where we “earn the pay” so as to improve that airmanship and experience, but again somewhere we need to draw the line.
Im also on the conservative gas side—I’m surprised that they had the gas for two attempts!
03-28-2024, 05:58 PM
#23
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Aug 2019
Posts: 420
For the record, when I was Captain at my regional pre-COVID, all my worst FOs were hired by Delta. They were all blond young woman. Just sayin
03-29-2024, 03:51 AM
#24
In a land of unicorns
Joined APC: Apr 2014
Position: Whale FO
Posts: 6,471
Originally Posted by CoefficientX
You’ll make a good DGS instructor. I’m aware of the nuance. Personally, I’d look at the big picture, screaming tailwind on final, headwind on landing. If I’m on my second approach and the guy 3-4 miles in front of me goes around for wind shear, I’m going around too. Another loop around the patch buys some time to get better clarification.
So technically correct, the JB guys never used the word pirep. As someone else mentioned, they were in the thick of a go-around, from wind shear, perfect phraseology can escape us all.
So technically correct, the JB guys never used the word pirep. As someone else mentioned, they were in the thick of a go-around, from wind shear, perfect phraseology can escape us all.
Thats why AIM 4-2-1(b). Use whatever words are necessary to get your message across. FAA does not enforce strict phraseology.
03-29-2024, 03:12 PM
#25
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Oct 2006
Position: Center seat, doing loops to music
Posts: 825
Originally Posted by at6d
I recently flew with a newhire female that became so frazzled after a missed approach that for her the flight became….over.
03-29-2024, 04:19 PM
#26
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2013
Posts: 3,445
Originally Posted by hindsight2020
wow. This legit antagonizes me as a paying pax. There's zero place for manifestation-of-apprehension (.mil training term) cases or demonstrated susceptibility, in a revenue 121 cockpit. Training is supposed to attrit weak 'ish out the door way before it makes it to a revenue flight. If the flying public knew. I commend you guys for acting as bona fide glove-save, but this stuff is Colgan level unsat. Industry keeps effing around on this issue, someone's gonna roll snake eyes eventually.
I have seen a definite huge delta between the lowest and highest performing FOs recently. There is no demographic to predict it other than perhaps age and total hours. 6 months in a SkyWest right seat just doesn't get most of us enough reps to bench press a varsity day at LGA.
Fortunately there are two pilots up there.
Last edited by e6bpilot; 03-29-2024 at 04:41 PM.
03-29-2024, 04:47 PM
#27
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jul 2013
Posts: 10,067
Originally Posted by e6bpilot
It's a sign of the times. Gone are the days of hiring folks with 10 years of skill building exposure to hazardous environments.
I have seen a definite huge delta between the lowest and highest performing FOs recently. There is no demographic to predict it other than perhaps age and total hours. 6 months in a SkyWest right seat just doesn't get most of us enough reps to bench press a varsity day at LGA.
Fortunately there are two pilots up there.
I have seen a definite huge delta between the lowest and highest performing FOs recently. There is no demographic to predict it other than perhaps age and total hours. 6 months in a SkyWest right seat just doesn't get most of us enough reps to bench press a varsity day at LGA.
Fortunately there are two pilots up there.
03-29-2024, 05:17 PM
#28
Occasional box hauler
Joined APC: Jan 2018
Posts: 1,685
Originally Posted by CBreezy
Except RJs fly a lot into LGA as well and the regionals seem to do alright. Legacy and major training/mentorship programs need to adjust.
03-29-2024, 05:19 PM
#29
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2018
Posts: 2,987
Originally Posted by tnkrdrvr
This right here. If your newhire FOs look like new regional FOs, then perhaps your training program should be like a regional airline’s training program.
03-29-2024, 05:58 PM
#30
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2013
Posts: 3,445
Originally Posted by CBreezy
Except RJs fly a lot into LGA as well and the regionals seem to do alright. Legacy and major training/mentorship programs need to adjust.
It's about reps. The average RJ guy based in NYC is going to go to LGA a bazillion times. A DEN based OO pilot for 6 months who goes to a major isn't going to have that same experience. The training departments are adjusting, but at the majors it's more about getting someone through training vs the attrition program at the regionals. Very few people fail training at a major airline.
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