duffrick

Mr. Stratton,

You are indeed correct. The 100 seat payscales are not published on this website. Here are the DOS pay rates for some CA and F/O positions.


77-100 Seat A/C
Year 1 CA: 78.57 F/O: 29.65
Year 12 CA: 98.58 F/O: 57.52

EMB 195
Year 1 CA: 78.57 F/O: 29.65
Year 12 CA: 105.00 F/O: 61.26

101-110 Seat A/C
Year 1 CA: 78.57 F/O: 29.65
Year 12 CA: 116.37 F/O: 69.60

DC-9 (100-124 Seats)
Year 1 CA: 113.49 F/O: 29.65
Year 12 CA: 123.68 F/O: 84.10

A320 F/O
Year 12 F/O: 93.12

B757 F/O
Year 12 F/O: 96.75

A330 F/O
Year 12 F/O: 108.21

B747/400 F/O
Year 12 F/O: 120.15

I put in some F/O rates on other equipment to illustrate where the Captains on these SJ's will be coming from. The F/O positions on the SJ's will be filled with recalls or new-hires. Not a very good deal for the recalls, but not too terrible if you're coming from a commuter.

As you can see these rates are nothing to write home about, that's for sure. How do these rates compare with the other operators out there that fly these things? They are certainly not industry leading, but not too bad.

As far as when these airplanes are coming, all I can say is that we haven't even ordered anything yet! You know as well as I do that it's impossible to take a large number of aircraft right away. The most I've heard of is two-three airplanes per month, and that is when the first delivery positions come available. I am sure that Embraer doesn't have 50-75 EMB-170 or -195's mothballed somewhere, just waiting to be delivered. There is a long line for these things.

My guess is that we wont see any replacements for the DC-9 before late 2007. If we have parked a bunch of 9's by then, we'll have some more furloughs. If the pension bill passes, I bet you'll see a ton of guys retiring early, that would offset some of the furloughs.

As far as the 76 seaters, my guess is that we'll see 55 of those in NWA colors very soon. They will certainly be used to offset the parking of DC-9's but can't replace the 150 9's on the property at the moment. I believe the bottom line is that we can't park a bunch of 9's without losing market share, something these yin-yang's have been defending tooth and nail for the last 50 years.

reddog25

First of all...I am a A320 Captain (19 year) for NWA. I voted NO...I appologize to all my fellow pilots out there who will have to follow this contract. Apparently there are 63% of our pilots who couldn't find their gonads or ovaries. Duffrick states that NWA won't be able to find the $$ to replace the DC-9s with 51-76 seaters. He is correct. Our spineless pilot's have allowed a seperate company, Compass, to buy the airplanes. GEEEEEZZZEEE. One of the main reasons I voted NO. NWA has lifted Texas Air shell game to a new level. I fought in Iraq in 2004 and can tell you what in comming rockets or mortars sound like....it sounds like this contract!

dckozak

Well guy's here you get it from Mgt point of view. This management prick couldn't managed a toilet roll but is way smarter than a mear airline pilot.
Could you imagine if we had a flying record as good as they have (in running a company) ??

Just another bruised, (wish he was a) pilot who didn't make it, probably flunked out of flight school, but could (barely) make it in management.

Those who can do, those who can't, manage.
Those who can't manage, run airlines.

duffrick

First of all, you don't have to apologize to anyone for the TA being ratified. You may be thinking that our profession as a whole relied on our vote on this TA. I simply don't think that's the case. Our pilot group at NWA isn't big enough to send reverberations of testosterone and grandeur to the entire profession. That opportunity was squandered by the pilots who knelt down before the bankruptcy altar ahead of us.

Secondly, I really doubt that we will be buying airplanes for Compass in any significant numbers if they can't generate positive revenue. Until oil and Jet A prices come down (which may never happen!) the economic feasibility of a even a 70-seater is in question. Most airlines future economic forecasts seem to rely on $50-$60/barrel oil, the current prices of mid $70's is probably making more than one CFO a little nervous about the lilliput jets.

Third, one of the reasons I voted "YES" to this TA was my sincere belief (*******ed up as it may be) that NWA will be part of a consolidation of some sort within the next 3-5 years. That would most likely render this TA moot anyway. I base this on my airline industry theory: "if you can't beat'em, join'em." The DOJ isn't likely to stop any mergers involving bankrupt carriers if it will save the airline that's bankrupt. Either CO or DL could be possible bed-mates.

Unfortunately, a merger would probably mean furlough's (can you say AA-TWA?) for a bunch of guys since there would probably be a streamlining of capacity and an elimination of redundancy.

2dotslow

Either this board is infested with 10 percenters, or I struck a nerve with some of the more visceral union pukes amongst this group of mear airline pilots. My, my, some do take themselves so seriously.

reddog25

Well it doesn't matter anymore....I respect your decision to vote YES,,,I only ask that you remember you voted YES and for the next 7 years don't complain...you didn't pay for that right.........Jon

CO737,3,5,7,8,9

What has happened to labor in general in this country is sad to say the least. People have lost jobs, retirements, homes, marriages etc. etc. To add insult to injury we then have pilot wanna-be, posers, management lurkers, and plainly mean spirited people come on here, like 2dotslow, and intentionally rub salt into the wounds of people that are truly hurting. I don't understand why someone would want to do that. I am certain of one thing though, you will "reap what you sow" and you will be judged in the end. Good luck.

757Driver

Reddog,

Welcome to the club I was one of the 42%'ers who voted No over here. I've never seen so many people buy into the Pied Piper schpeel before in this industry. We, over at CAL, are already feeling the effects of approving a contract that wasn't even completed. Management was given a blank document to fill in at their leisure and now the Yes voters are up in arms, unbelievable.

Its amazing how many guys, (like Duffrick), will grasp at any straw just to keep himself employed. I would have gladly walked with the other 42% just to preserve what we have.

As I said before, one of the lowest points in ALPA history was NWA's approval of this contract.

duffrick

Jon,

I don't take any of my decisions lightly. Believe me when I say that voting for the TA was the most difficult decision I have made since I started flying 20 years ago.

But, I am not a whiner and will suck it up and take it like a man if it turns out to be the wrong decision. As I have said in my previous posts on this forum; If I believe that could we have done better by turning this TA down, I would have voted to do so, period. The risk-reward just wasn't there in my humble opinion.

duffrick

I will watch with great interest when you ballsy, studly pilots over there at CAL are facing your next negotiations. Perhaps you can show us pussies how its done.

Anything less than an industry leading contract will be extremely disappointing, right? Go get it Tiger!