CAL #4 and NWA #5
06-15-2006, 01:05 PM
#71
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2005
Posts: 2,002
Originally Posted by Ottopilot
Only half of the flight is at night, since the sun comes up at 1:00am ET 
(->flying towards the sun).
Copa is a Panamainian airline painted similair to CAL. CAL owned a small miniority stake in them- I don't know how much it is or was anymore. Continental Micronesia is the CAL Guam base. It is operated as a subsiderary of CAL, with pilots from the CAL pilot list. All 737-800 ETOPS aircraft.
(->flying towards the sun). Copa is a Panamainian airline painted similair to CAL. CAL owned a small miniority stake in them- I don't know how much it is or was anymore. Continental Micronesia is the CAL Guam base. It is operated as a subsiderary of CAL, with pilots from the CAL pilot list. All 737-800 ETOPS aircraft.
sarcasm, I'm a big fan of that...
Otto, facts only confuse cargosusan.
06-16-2006, 06:07 AM
#74
Need More Callouts
Joined APC: Dec 2005
Position: Unbridled Enthusiasm
Posts: 2,143
Originally Posted by Ottopilot
Copa is a Panamainian airline painted similair to CAL. CAL owned a small miniority stake in them- I don't know how much it is or was anymore.
06-16-2006, 03:27 PM
#76
Line Holder
Joined APC: May 2006
Position: Left
Posts: 37
Originally Posted by thomas39
Ok I am doing your homework for you. Here is the scope per the new NWA contract as it deals with small jet flying. NWA pilots kept additional scope protections not related to the Small Jet or RJ flying as well, but let's not get into that right now.
UNLIMITED 50 seat aircraft. A MAX of 90 76-seat aircraft of which 35 shall go to Compass where NWA furloughed pilots shall start at year 2 CAPT rates or year 4 FO rates. This leaves 55 76-seat aircraft of which 35 shall replace the AVRO's at Mesaba. This now leaves only 20 additional 76 seat aircraft to be flown at one of the feeders or they may all go to Compass. If they are financed by or through NWA then 1/2 of all CAPT and 1/2 of all FO positions must be filled by NWA furloughed pilots for these 20 additional airplanes. Also note that if the narrowbody fleet is reduced (your assertation that NWA shall start parking the DC-9) then the MAX number must be reduced to 55 TOTAL. The only replacement plan for the DC-9 is 77+ seat aircraft that must be flown at mainline and only replace those DC-9's that are due for retirement anyway. The company has specifically stated their market plan will not allow the DC-9 fleet to be parked and replaced by RJ's. They simply need these airplanes to fly the schedule.
Elsewhere in the industry:
CAL - UNLIMITED 50 seat aircraft
UAL - UNLIMITED 70-seat aircraft equal to 100% of mainline blockhours
DAL - MAX of 200 70-seat aircraft
AA- 50 70-seat aircraft
US Airways - 93 90-seat aircraft. 115 70-76 seat aircraft
Also note the NWA contract was obtained after UAL, AA, & US Airways set industry precedence giving up much larger scope protections as it relates to the RJ's in question. Obviously NWA management wanted more. NWA pilots fought damm hard to preserve scope and did the best they could.
Tell me Eric and 757 Driver, since you have all of the answers to negotiating the industry's best contract, what union office or committee do you serve on now? Have you ever stepped up and actually did something for your fellow pilots or the profession?
Or have you simply moaned and groaned on the sidelines, ridiculing and watching others work on your behalf?
And as far as skipping off into the sunset with the industry's best contract - you must be completely insane. Take a look back at your own airline's history. Continental has historically held the lowest pay/benefit/retirement package. So you have settled for your own *hit year after year after year.
UNLIMITED 50 seat aircraft. A MAX of 90 76-seat aircraft of which 35 shall go to Compass where NWA furloughed pilots shall start at year 2 CAPT rates or year 4 FO rates. This leaves 55 76-seat aircraft of which 35 shall replace the AVRO's at Mesaba. This now leaves only 20 additional 76 seat aircraft to be flown at one of the feeders or they may all go to Compass. If they are financed by or through NWA then 1/2 of all CAPT and 1/2 of all FO positions must be filled by NWA furloughed pilots for these 20 additional airplanes. Also note that if the narrowbody fleet is reduced (your assertation that NWA shall start parking the DC-9) then the MAX number must be reduced to 55 TOTAL. The only replacement plan for the DC-9 is 77+ seat aircraft that must be flown at mainline and only replace those DC-9's that are due for retirement anyway. The company has specifically stated their market plan will not allow the DC-9 fleet to be parked and replaced by RJ's. They simply need these airplanes to fly the schedule.
Elsewhere in the industry:
CAL - UNLIMITED 50 seat aircraft
UAL - UNLIMITED 70-seat aircraft equal to 100% of mainline blockhours
DAL - MAX of 200 70-seat aircraft
AA- 50 70-seat aircraft
US Airways - 93 90-seat aircraft. 115 70-76 seat aircraft
Also note the NWA contract was obtained after UAL, AA, & US Airways set industry precedence giving up much larger scope protections as it relates to the RJ's in question. Obviously NWA management wanted more. NWA pilots fought damm hard to preserve scope and did the best they could.
Tell me Eric and 757 Driver, since you have all of the answers to negotiating the industry's best contract, what union office or committee do you serve on now? Have you ever stepped up and actually did something for your fellow pilots or the profession?
Or have you simply moaned and groaned on the sidelines, ridiculing and watching others work on your behalf?
And as far as skipping off into the sunset with the industry's best contract - you must be completely insane. Take a look back at your own airline's history. Continental has historically held the lowest pay/benefit/retirement package. So you have settled for your own *hit year after year after year.
06-16-2006, 04:06 PM
#77
Need More Callouts
Joined APC: Dec 2005
Position: Unbridled Enthusiasm
Posts: 2,143
Originally Posted by Bleedovertemp
Thank God someone finally said it.
Pathetic and embarassing.
Last edited by 757Driver; 06-16-2006 at 04:10 PM.
06-16-2006, 04:08 PM
#78
Need More Callouts
Joined APC: Dec 2005
Position: Unbridled Enthusiasm
Posts: 2,143
Originally Posted by Eric Stratton
They just sold more of copa? When?
After completion of the proposed offering, Continental Airlines will continue to hold about 12.3 percent in Copa Holdings, or a 10 percent interest if the over allotment option is exercised in full, Copa Holdings said in a statement. (Reporting by Devidutta Tripathy in Bangalore)
06-16-2006, 04:31 PM
#79
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2006
Position: A320 CA
Posts: 973
Originally Posted by 757Driver
In the old days sonny, furloughees were a part of life but the guys staying on the property made sure that they had a decent contract to return to someday. Quit the "all about me" attitude and think about the future.
06-16-2006, 08:04 PM
#80
Need More Callouts
Joined APC: Dec 2005
Position: Unbridled Enthusiasm
Posts: 2,143
Originally Posted by reddog25
Pardon me if I'm wrong...I'm never sure which CAL pilots are scabs unless I look at my scab list (which I do before I give a CAL pilot a JS ride)...but when you say "in the old days sonny" and speak down to a fellow pilot...well ya sound like a self centered scab....give my fellow furloughed NWA pilot a break!
Since I've been at CAL, I've made it my life's work to improve the conditions that my scabbie breathren had created. After we got a Union I devoted 100's of hours volunteering for the Union from its inception to the present day. All that permiting, I've been called every name in the book by the following airlines Pilots who, just for being employed by CAL, thought I deserved to be called the dreaded "S" word:
American
Delta
Northwest
US Air
United
I knew that these uninformed fellas were not happy with the crappy contract I labored under and they certainly would not take the time to find out just how hard I was working on improving things at CAL, so I let it pass.
Now that you have the absolute WORST contract out there should I call each and every one of you a "Scab"?
Nope, I would have manned any picket line you guys would have assembled and proudly helped in any way that I could have to protect what you had.
Instead some frightened little Pilots believed every word management told them and voted yes on a contract that will haunt them for years.
To those of you who had the common sense to vote "No", I thank you. To those whose feeble attempts to call me names and sent in their frightened "Yes" votes I wish you success at the new and improved NWA.
Last edited by 757Driver; 06-17-2006 at 06:53 AM.
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