Delta Pilots Association
11-22-2013 | 04:54 PM
#8421
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Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 12,487
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From: 747-400 Captain
If you don't like your words read back to you, consider asking a mod to edit your words.
Carl
11-22-2013 | 05:19 PM
#8422
Moderator
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 13,088
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From: B757/767
It's easy to make promises when you can't be held accountable.
11-22-2013 | 05:30 PM
#8423
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Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 12,487
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From: 747-400 Captain
That's great. I'm adamant about it too. I'm also adamant about eliminating the RLA. Just because an organization claims to be adamant about something, doesn't mean they have a plan to get there. It also doesn't mean they can achieve it.
It's easy to make promises when you can't be held accountable.
It's easy to make promises when you can't be held accountable.
DPA is discussing it...and discussing it very directly.
Carl
11-22-2013 | 05:36 PM
#8424
Moderator
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 13,088
Likes: 0
From: B757/767
But ALPA is not adamant about insourcing johnso. ALPA refuses to even discuss outsourcing/insourcing. Since ALPA is the current bargaining agent and (as you say) is accountable, why is ALPA refusing to even discuss what you and I both want?
DPA is discussing it...and discussing it very directly.
Carl
DPA is discussing it...and discussing it very directly.
Carl
As I said, DPA can promise whatever they would like. Based on what they've shown us, there is little assurance that they will achieve it. It's all hope. Not worth it to me.
11-22-2013 | 06:05 PM
#8425
Da Hudge
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 17,473
Likes: 0
From: Poodle Whisperer
11-22-2013 | 06:32 PM
#8426
Back on TDY
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 12,487
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From: 747-400 Captain
No, scope loosening.
Decreasing number of RJ's that both management and passengers hated, but increasing jumbo RJ's that management and passengers prefer.
Only on paper. When paper promises won't be met, DALPA ignores it.
See above.
That metric won't even be measured for the first time until Jan 2014. Then management doesn't even have to pretend to do something about it until July 2014.
That is correct. Show me one single sentence in ANY ALPA document that discusses outsourcing, or the attempt to insource. Now don't go radio silent again on this johnso, show us ANY such ALPA document.
Carl
Decreasing number of RJ's that both management and passengers hated, but increasing jumbo RJ's that management and passengers prefer.
Only on paper. When paper promises won't be met, DALPA ignores it.
See above.
That metric won't even be measured for the first time until Jan 2014. Then management doesn't even have to pretend to do something about it until July 2014.
That is correct. Show me one single sentence in ANY ALPA document that discusses outsourcing, or the attempt to insource. Now don't go radio silent again on this johnso, show us ANY such ALPA document.
Carl
11-22-2013 | 08:01 PM
#8427
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 3,716
Likes: 0
An opinion from someone who doesn't pay ALAP dues anymore.
Voting to replace ALPA is a big decision that can't be made emotionally. ALPA will try to instill fear of change and the competing union will try to instill anger. Neither is helping by trying to ingest emotion. This must be a rationale decision.
For me, ALPA had many strong points but in the end they presumed too much autonomy from the pilots that pay the dues. Too many times the ALPA leaders made important decisions without seriously taking membership opinions into account or flatly denied membership ratification when the membership made it clear they wanted a ratification vote.
In the end, ALPA's apparent disregard or apathy toward pilot opinion is what did them in.
I expect my representatives to represent the pilots that pay them dues. ALPA simply had too many conflicting interests and ALAP national was completely oblivious to our airlines issues. Not their fault. Its just the way it all developed over the years.
I like that all our reps are elected by the membership and directly accountable to us the membership. They listen because they have to.... No national job to chase... no other pilot group dues to lust after.
Soem folks like ALPA. To each his own.
Its just a vote. What's the harm in a vote?
Voting to replace ALPA is a big decision that can't be made emotionally. ALPA will try to instill fear of change and the competing union will try to instill anger. Neither is helping by trying to ingest emotion. This must be a rationale decision.
For me, ALPA had many strong points but in the end they presumed too much autonomy from the pilots that pay the dues. Too many times the ALPA leaders made important decisions without seriously taking membership opinions into account or flatly denied membership ratification when the membership made it clear they wanted a ratification vote.
In the end, ALPA's apparent disregard or apathy toward pilot opinion is what did them in.
I expect my representatives to represent the pilots that pay them dues. ALPA simply had too many conflicting interests and ALAP national was completely oblivious to our airlines issues. Not their fault. Its just the way it all developed over the years.
I like that all our reps are elected by the membership and directly accountable to us the membership. They listen because they have to.... No national job to chase... no other pilot group dues to lust after.
Soem folks like ALPA. To each his own.
Its just a vote. What's the harm in a vote?
11-23-2013 | 04:26 AM
#8429
Line Holder
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 1,257
Likes: 5
Someone posted that we should just have a vote and get it over with. They said we have ALPA now and either DPA or ALPA after, but that isn't quite correct is it? Couldn't we end up with no union, Teamsters or heck IAM? Once it goes to vote anything put down on the cards gets a vote. Did anyone see that in the FA vote ALPA got some votes? Not saying we shouldn't vote, just wanted to make sure there are more than just two possibilities.
11-23-2013 | 05:25 AM
#8430
Back on TDY
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 12,487
Likes: 0
From: 747-400 Captain
Someone posted that we should just have a vote and get it over with. They said we have ALPA now and either DPA or ALPA after, but that isn't quite correct is it? Couldn't we end up with no union, Teamsters or heck IAM? Once it goes to vote anything put down on the cards gets a vote. Did anyone see that in the FA vote ALPA got some votes? Not saying we shouldn't vote, just wanted to make sure there are more than just two possibilities.
The only way we could end up with no union is if a majority specifically voted to become non-union.
Carl
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