The AirTran Pilots' Windfall and SLI
01-31-2011, 10:41 AM
#632
veut gagner à la loterie
Joined APC: Apr 2008
Position: Light Chop
Posts: 23,286
01-31-2011, 10:47 AM
#634
veut gagner à la loterie
Joined APC: Apr 2008
Position: Light Chop
Posts: 23,286
Well, hmmmm. You know the way you ask that puts what I meant into a new context. I was thinking more along the lines of wearing one of these because the arbitrator is going to kick someone where the sun doesn't shine whether it be for real or for not achieving one's perceived rightful outcome.
Mongo!!
Mongo!!
01-31-2011, 10:49 AM
#635
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Oct 2009
Posts: 224
I think you just did. You feel that every AirTran FO should be put under you. Is that your middle ground ?
01-31-2011, 11:55 AM
#636
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2008
Posts: 1,619
Generally speaking, I think the Southwest pilots that have chosen to post their opinions on what should happen to the AAI pilots have not been... the best representatives of their position.
Nonetheless, I don't think they will get a straight relative seniority award. For starters, this is not an ALPA merger. As such, it falls under Allegheny-Mohawk through Bond-McCaskill:
http://www.house.leg.state.mn.us/hrd/pubs/airlinemg.pdf
It seems as though the process is even less defined than ALPA merger policy, and there is an interesting statement there about the fairness of the process being considered more important than the fairness of the outcome. Personally, I don't believe it: arbitrators are trying to craft a workable list, not an ideoogically, or philosophically based list. I think arbitrators really work for management, and are trying to craft lists that can be successfully implemented, with minimum fuss. There is a lot of money at stake, and the owners require stability as an outcome. In this case, they don't want to go down the UsAir...way, so I think they'll create something not too obnoxious to the AAI pilots, but since the LUV group is larger, they're going to throw them a bone also. I don't know what point the arbitrators will latch onto, but they're going to give them something, the same way the arbitrators gave the NW pilots credit for future attrition, as a means to get to the outcome they always wanted: a workable list that management can implement.
For example, I don't know if we're right to bunch the 737 with the 717 or not. I'm not making an argument one way or another, I'm only saying that the arbitrators will make up their own mind about the relevance, and it's not a clear-cut matter.
The sooner everyone undrestands this isn't about their feelings, or about "fairness", the better off they will be. I'm sure U few won't ever figure this out, but they play a role too: they make the thread more entertaining as they work their blood pressure ever higher.
Nonetheless, I don't think they will get a straight relative seniority award. For starters, this is not an ALPA merger. As such, it falls under Allegheny-Mohawk through Bond-McCaskill:
http://www.house.leg.state.mn.us/hrd/pubs/airlinemg.pdf
It seems as though the process is even less defined than ALPA merger policy, and there is an interesting statement there about the fairness of the process being considered more important than the fairness of the outcome. Personally, I don't believe it: arbitrators are trying to craft a workable list, not an ideoogically, or philosophically based list. I think arbitrators really work for management, and are trying to craft lists that can be successfully implemented, with minimum fuss. There is a lot of money at stake, and the owners require stability as an outcome. In this case, they don't want to go down the UsAir...way, so I think they'll create something not too obnoxious to the AAI pilots, but since the LUV group is larger, they're going to throw them a bone also. I don't know what point the arbitrators will latch onto, but they're going to give them something, the same way the arbitrators gave the NW pilots credit for future attrition, as a means to get to the outcome they always wanted: a workable list that management can implement.
For example, I don't know if we're right to bunch the 737 with the 717 or not. I'm not making an argument one way or another, I'm only saying that the arbitrators will make up their own mind about the relevance, and it's not a clear-cut matter.
The sooner everyone undrestands this isn't about their feelings, or about "fairness", the better off they will be. I'm sure U few won't ever figure this out, but they play a role too: they make the thread more entertaining as they work their blood pressure ever higher.
That is why all the arguments about the future and career expectations go flying out the window. That is why the most recent arbitrations have gone by a ratio. (US Air/Trump Shuttle, Polar/Atlas, US Air/AWA, and DL/NW). In many of those cases, different views of the future had small effects on the outcome of the list, but in general, you had a ratio that kept everyone just about in the same seat as when they started. That is why I think the SWA/AAI case will go similarly. There may be some adjustments for contract value and longevity, but not massive changes. The idea that any large part of the AAI pilots would get stapled to the bottom of the SWA list seems highly out of character with the most recent cases. You never know, but if SWA pilots are banking on it, they may be sorely disappointed.
01-31-2011, 12:41 PM
#639
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Sep 2008
Position: "Prof" button manipulator
Posts: 1,685
T,
Not yet a WN pilot, but a "wannabe" WN pilot (think he's actually in the pool), who will also be led to believe after the "kool-aid" that "relative seniority" means all the FL pilots being "stapled".
Link included for humorous reading.
Jake Pavelka - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
GJ
Orville Redenbacher is my favorite.
Not yet a WN pilot, but a "wannabe" WN pilot (think he's actually in the pool), who will also be led to believe after the "kool-aid" that "relative seniority" means all the FL pilots being "stapled".
Link included for humorous reading.
Jake Pavelka - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
GJ
Orville Redenbacher is my favorite.
01-31-2011, 12:45 PM
#640
Che Guevara
Joined APC: Aug 2005
Posts: 6,408
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