Columbusohio

I have had an app in for 3 months, not a peep either. 7000K hours, military IP, but just an Army turboprop guy.

LibertyPilot

Guys, here is my take on Frontier and I am no expert on F9, just sharing what I learned at the conference. If you want a shot at working for Frontier then you need to go talk to them at a conference or job fair. It appears that is where the majority of interview slots are coming from.

As for me, I would probably like it there. The pilots I met had a great attitude and were very humble. However, in my situation with kids I cannot afford the first year pay. For someone in another situation this may be a good opportunity both short or long term. Good luck guys!

Purple Drank

How do you figure?
Don't forget "prior athlete"

Macjet

I'll reiterate that. I think it'd be a good job with some good crews. I know a few and they're all great guys. But the pay is abysmal. I've been running the numbers and it looks to be right around a $100,000 pay cut to take the job. I've got young kids too and other obligations. And I don't see how, even with a second job, I could possibly make this work.

Skylove0618

I was in a recent new hire class. We had 5 or 6 corporate pilots that had NO prior 121 experience. Yes, the majority of the class did have prior 121, but that is the bulk of who is applying so that should be expected.

When I was hired (Nov '14), they seemed less concerned with the technical stuff. The interviewers did seem to be more concerned with personality, desire to stay at Frontier, and are you willing to learn and do things the way Frontier does. I firmly believe this as it seemed the qualifications in my class were all over the place. The only commonality my classmates and I had was that we all came from another professional pilot job (135/121/military).

I had:

7,500 TT
1,200 PIC (0 turbine)
1 Type
7 years 121
4 year degree
40+ years old

CaptKrunch

I also feel the same way. I would love to work at Frontier, but it would be somewhere around a 55k$ pay cut. I wouldn't make it back to my pay now untill year 4 Fo.
Just curious how are the guys who are going there adjusting? Or what is your plan once you get there?

sulkair

Was difficult for sure. One thing that kicked in for me that helped was EIC to the tune of about 4K. But I have two young kids and my wife stays home with them, so I met the income standards. Also because of this, we claimed 8 on our W4 and had zero federal tax withheld because we literally wouldn't owe any. If you are in a similar situation as me, with kids, and no income from a spouse, you and your family will undoubtedly also qualify for Medicare. So you can get a break on having to pay health insurance for your first year. (at least in Colorado you will.)

So for my situation on reserve I was netting ~2900 to ~3000 per month depending on how much per-diem I received. If I would have stayed in Phoenix and commuted this would have been doable, but paying rent in Denver more than doubled my housing costs, so we ate into savings every month. Second year pay has come in the nick of time, LOL.

One big disclaimer for myself. I was earning very close to the same amount for roughly the 2 years prior as a downgraded regional FO. So I was accustomed and budgeted for 3K /mo take home. However I was about to re-upgrade when I left so it wasn't a simple decision.

I was born and raised in Denver, so coming home and getting the kids near their grandparents was a huge draw for me. As was the culture and reputation of the Frontier pilots. Also, being a bit older, 44, the prospect of growth with an upgrade half the time of a Legacy attracted me. In addition the idea of stability with the likes of Indigo behind us made sense at the time. (just being honest.) I also felt the pay would rise with a new contract sooner than later.

These were just my rationalizations at the time. I make no claim whatsoever as to their validity going forward.

I'm looking forward to riding this puppy out - and I think listening to you guys talk candidly about projected hardships with regard to compensation is a great indicator that we may approaching a climate wherein the market will dictate better pay in order to draw quality individuals to join our growing ranks.

Again, the only other option will be to scrape dredges from the bottom of the barrel. And I don't mean those with poor skills. I mean those with poor personal skills. Please no! All of F9 reminds me of the tight-nit little group of cool dudes we had on the Dash8 at Mesa, as compared to the swath of older DB's on the CRJ - what a nightmare these guys could be to work with! We must preserve the integrity of this pilot group, it makes this place distinctly exceptional in my opinion, all other factors notwithstanding!

TMI-Sulk

sulkair

addendum: Most guys in my class held some form of a line* with regularity after 6 months with the Co. This would allow them to build up their schedule high above 75 hrs min guarantee if they are gluttons for it I know one guy in particular a few classes ahead of me that consistently clocked over 100 hrs credit as a newhire in his first year. Actually he's still doing it and he is always in danger of timing out in his rolling 365. To me, this is madness, but to those who really need to increase their income, there does appear to be some real options once you can get a line*. Also even on RSV there is a voluntary junior assignment list that could help pad the 1st year. I've never put myself on it, but I still get called from time-to-time on my days off to see if I'd like to pick up a high credit turn to go on top of guarantee. Again, not for me, but to each-his-own.


* un-awarded relief line, relief line, or regular line. all of which are alterable with swap/drop/add capability.

PilotJ3

How is the reserve sistem in F9. I'm thinking to make F9 or B6 my last stop. I really don't need to go to a legacy. Just trying to take make the best informed decision.

I will be visiting both places in the upcoming job fairs.

sulkair

Simply put you paper bid for one of 5 shifts

A 0400-1430
B 0800-1830
C 1200-2230
D 1700-2400
E 1900-0200

In my experience no one shift goes necessarily jr or sr. Weekends off seem to be what goes senior.

The blocks of RSV days usually consist of a mix of 4 and 5 day blocks.

On any given day you will be organized into groups (buckets) of days of availability with other pilots in your same shift.

They call out the pilot who flew least recently (first-in-first-out) in the bucket with the days of availability matching the open trip. If there are no pilots in the bucket that matches the days of the trip, they will go up to the next bucket.

For example if 2 day comes open. They have no 2 day guys available so they will go up and call the 'first in' 3 day bucket guy.

2 hour call out.

If you want you can peruse open-time and 'aggressive bid' a trip that you might like to fly. Doesn't have to match your bucket, but generally has to fit your shift, unless no-one else bids it, and if they have coverage they might award it to you. This is is a seniority based bid that runs from 1000 to 1330 everyday for the NEXT day's trip starts.

12 days off per month.

I come from a seniority based call me first/ call me last system, and also did a lowest credit - first out system for awhile. I'm still getting used to Frontier's but I think it is a decent system. I like how you can do a quick turn and be put back to the back of the list. The credit one drove me crazy.

Swapping reserve days in FLICA is a mixed bag. Sometimes it works for me, sometimes it doesn't.

You can bid Relief lines which are RSV lines that can be converted into a real line in a secondary bid function. But only if you want. If none look appealing to you, you can allow it to stay a RSV line.

As a regular RSV (non relief) holder, you can sometimes still bid in a yet 'nother bid function for "unawarded relief lines"

RSV at frontier generally goes JR. But this last bid surprised me. There were a surprising number of pretty senior pilots bidding RSV. Possibly for the days off, or because they thought staffing was such that they wouldn't fly much, not sure.

When you finish an assignment you have to call in to scheduling...

•If they have something on your schedule (theoretically put there before you landed) you're obligated to go back out, but in this instance, unless they're tapped out of any other reserves, they have to release you as soon as the trip returns to base, and can only make you do one more overnight.

• If they have nothing on your schedule when you call they are obligated to release you to your rest/days off. In my last year I've been nabbed probably 1 out of 10 times. That said we're in hiring mode. I know in the past when they were short, or sometimes even now on the CA side, it is much more likely to happen.

NO hot/ready reserve! Yes I made it to a Major! Whew!

Thats pretty much it in a big nutshell. There are contract provisions, too much to go into here, that spell out when they need to release you by, or if when they can extend you etc.

Hope this helps.