Come work for Allegiant…it's pure PLATINUM!
 

Get to know what a true Platinum standard looks like, accountability and transparency beyond comparison! Unmatched quality of life, working conditions and benefits! Quick upgrades and high quality training in the best maintained equipment in the airline business!!!

Stop laughing.

Here's what you can really expect:

An insulting and unprofessional interview process

Inadequate training that has literally been shut down by the FAA and resulted in terminations, certificate action and resignations (feeling lucky?). Poor simulator support, rushed and minimal hours in training, old and outdated materials, inexperienced instructors, etc. Be ready for the excuses.

If you manage to get through, expect years of TDY you will be living in hotels while on reserve with un-commutable schedules.

While you are there, you will be jerked around every day by a scheduler that was just hired last week and will probably quit tomorrow. Like most other support functions, they have no idea what they are doing because turnover is so fast and middle managers are understaffed and overwhelmed. Expect a phone call at 4 am on your single day off to be junior assigned.

You won't have any control or visibility in to your schedule because our schedulers can't even figure out the Merlot PBS nightmare (keep track of your duty times because they can't, nor can they figure out seniority). Oh, and Merlot can't track your pay either.

Dispatch positions are also hired as apprentices and cut loose with little supervision. You're on your own out there so don't expect a call. Good luck getting more gas than the absolute minimum. No accounting for conditions enroute or arrival. Minimum legal.

Maintenance control, IT, Customer Service (contract), Ramp (contract), pubs, etc., are other agencies that are run on a shoestring budget with high turnover and frustration. You will be trying to catch their mistakes every day

Terribly maintained equipment with high engine failures, never ending flight control and flight guidance problems not being fixed by "apprentice mechanics" hired with no experience at sub-industry wages.

Being "pushed" and pressured to continue, even when you are stressed, fatigued or feeling the conditions are unsafe. Dispatch/scheduling: "are you refusing this assignment!?"

Punishing Management interrogations at corporate when you eventually stumble

It's no wonder the applications have slowed to a trickle and pilots are declining interviews. Management has ensured a very good chance of a strike. Now they have decided things are 'different' by designing TDY bases to accommodate the seasonal bumps our business plan uses. It has been our CEOs plan all along to create a highly mobile work force, (correction: flexible!) that can easily be moved between seasonal markets. We already have pilots that have been deployed for 18 months from home with very few chances to commute. Allegiant management couldn't care less about it's pilots and these policies are a clear example of that. Forced on us against a court-ordered status quo, despite our MEC's complaints, TDY basing was announced with virtually no specifics and only 2 days to bid. It was so unpopular that the left seat went to guys that were only signed off IOE in May. They probably have no idea what's in store for them.

All this for a thankless boss that offers the minimum (substandard compensation, work rules, and benefits), and staffs the operation to drive people to failure.

For those of us who have been here, the idea that a brand new hire, so badly trained, with so little experience in the shady -80 (very tough plane to fly), unaccustomed to the non-existent support, with broken planes, remote destinations and new hire FOs, this is very scary. ValueJet all over again (ValuGiant).

Unless you relish years of fatigue, frustration, disrespect, stress and risk (pink slip, Certificate action, accident, etc), don't come to Allegiant. Although our union is working hard at improving our conditions, it could be a long time before we get a contract and even then, we will still have the same management. There are too many other airlines out there that that recognize and value their employees. Many of our pilots, even relatively senior captains, are leaving because the conditions have become unbearable. In response, management simply shrugs their shoulders and presses on finding new ways to profit at the employees expense.

You have been warned.

Telling people to stay away from Allegiant is like trying to tell that kid that wants to see the cockpit not to become a pilot. They think you're crazy.

Then they see the light after it's too late.

We're not trying to be the cranky captain that you think is delusional. We're just trying to be up front about what you're about to sign up for.

I've been here for years and I can honestly say it's like flying for a cheap Part 135 outfit that skimps on maintenance, pays poorly, gives you no support and then looks for any reason to get a crew in trouble when a mistake happens.

If you make a mistake you will get sent to headquarters to be sat in front of a panel of strangers and your bosses, all of whom will interrogate you and second guess every thing you've done. They will ask if you gave the flight attendants a SCREAM briefing before the flight. They will interview the First Officer and Captain individually to try and intimidate you. They will go through all the paperwork and try and find any mistake you may have made. If you think I'm exaggerating call anyone who works here and ask.

Would you leave your regional for a sketchy Part 135 place that paid the same hourly rates as Allegiant? I understand most come because regionals pay dirt wages, but consider my question before making the jump.

And you still work there, why again? Seriously. If it sucks... that... bad.... :confused:

Often times truth is stranger than fiction.

When did this happen?

Gosh Dang! This sounds worse than a scuzzy regional! Very powerful write up Dawg. Truth is I'm hearing the exact same things from my friends there. It's too bad. About 4 years ago I wanted to work for G4 pretty badly. I'm glad now it didn't pan out. My best to you guys under unbearable and unforgivable circumstances.:(

Would I be here if the majors called? Would any of us?

Those hired away from Allegiant so far have gone to multiple job fairs all over the country until they are on a first name basis with the recruiters. And then those lucky few are chosen from several of their coworkers doing the same thing.

You assume Delta is just a phone call away. It's not.

If i am hired at republic. And i leave republic for allegiant. I will have moved up right?

Last fall for about a month or so. No training allowed whatsoever.

No it's not that, it's just from those posts I would assume swinging a hammer on a construction site would be better....

Hiring here though is going to continue for a long time. I really hope you can come here as soon as possible

Haha I've actually done that in the past. But I've got a wife and kids who like to eat three times a day so I'll put up with the frustration until the phone rings.

Seriously??? Are you really confused tsquare? You don't know this guy, you don't know his situation in life? Maybe he's got apps out at other places, maybe he doesn't.

Sometimes people have a sick family member or other dead serious reasons that preclude them from just walking on a six digit income! Maybe he's got a thousand good reasons for not just up and quitting.

Your question implies that it is wrong for a person to express out-loud the pitiful way in which an employer treats them unless they walk off the job first. That isn't real life, and it isn't always practical or wise and you know it!

That's because he's working at Delta. He assumes that because he found the golden ticket its out there for everybody. It isn't. That's the delusion virtually everyone here on APC labors under.

Face it, pal. You made it to the top of the commercial airline pyramid. There a thousands of pilots below you who will never be where you are no matter how many hundreds of pilots DAL hires in the next few years.

Someone is out there flying for regionals and crappy LCCs. Why they can't make to to the Borg is a mystery. But this place lives on the illusion that all they have to do is get 1000 TPIC and Delta/FedEx/UPS/AA/UCAL/Alaska/Hawaiian will be sending them a welcome aboard letter.

I've seen more than a few highly qualified military and civilian aviators get the TBNT letter. Why? Who knows. Maybe they didn't sit in the rocking chair. Whatever.

OK.. sorry. I read a post that was akin to being stuck in a North Vietnamese prison camp, and I asked a question. Seems to me that almost anything would be better than having bamboo shoots under your fingernails. So since I have no idea of the real "reason" of your post, I'll leave you guys to wallow in your own self pity... Have a wonderful weekend.


even you packrat.:rolleyes:

You are clueless as to what's going on. I suggest you return to your previous frequency, as you are coming in garbled and stupid.

Remember that many of us have been at Allegiant for 7-10 years. Allegiant was a life raft in an industry that was sinking after 9/11. It wasn't a fancy raft, but it stayed afloat and kept us alive. However, the current management has punctured holes in the raft that are causing us to take on water. The powers that be aren't even trying to patch them. Many of us are signaling the few 160,000 ton luxury cruise ships, but they won't take all of us (at least not right away). In the meantime, we are watching people jumping from perfectly safe smaller boats and starting to swim towards our raft just because it's "bigger" than the boat that they are on. I believe the first post was an attempt to signal those people to stay in their boats and wait for the cruise liner. For those whose boats are currently at the bottom of the ocean and are treading water, go ahead and swim towards our raft. But be advised that we are fresh out of Mai Tai's and shrimp cocktails.

I don’t think anyone here has given up on himself or herself, were just trying to add some balance to the crap our management is trying to sell. We're putting the unfiltered reality out there. Just so you know.

"You got a good gig man"

"These are good problems to have"
:D

As a pilot working for a part 135 operator, not the best, not the worst, I got a bad bad feeling during my phone interview, total D**ks, told them I would leave in 6 months if a major called. And they still offered me an interview. Wow, I hope you all find greener grass.

If you told them that you would leave short term and they still offered you an interview/job, what does that tell you?
:(

IF and IF is all i see

I just heard there were 5 engine failures in the last 4 weeks. Can anyone confirm this?

IF grandma had balls....

It's something very close to that, if not that exactly. I'm not sure if they were failures or if they were preemptive (it's going to fail soon anyway) shutdowns. On one of the other G4 threads, someone had links to the news articles. Aside from those, there was another one (eng shut down due to loss of oil pressure) a couple of days ago coming out of LAS. :rolleyes:

tsquare, I have no dog in this fight I'm not on either side. But your comment came across as the clueless Delta guy who forgot (or never knew) what it's really like at the levels below.

Technically with the shut down out of LAS the other day, that'd be 6 in 4 weeks. So far I believe I've been able to confirm them all (one not 100% sure on though).

I've got a buddy who's been there for some time. It's even worse than the OP says it is. I worked at a crappy 135 carrier. This place reminds me of that only it's much, much worse. I literally can't believe the stories I've heard, but they are too crazy not to be true, nobody could make that up. My heart goes out to you guys. If it weren't for the amazingly inflated stock price, the Feds would shut it down like they did to Great American years ago. Arrested a few people then as I recall too. Well, I hope nothing worse than crappy stories comes out of all of it. Be careful.

Research ValuJet a bit. The parallels between the two operations are terrifying.....

A Dec NH recently retired out of G4 because of the jerking around of bases and non-commutable schedules. He was a high-timer from a defunct cargo carrier and fortunately had enough $$ in the retirement account to tell AAY where to go.

Wikipedia's take on ValueJet

The airline went public in June, 1994 after a year of tremendous growth with the addition of 15 aircraft since the first flight in 1993. They became the fastest airline to make a profit in the history of American aviation, earning US$21 million in 1994 alone. In October 1995, ValuJet placed an order with McDonnell Douglas for 50 MD-95 jets (now known as the Boeing 717) with an option for 50 more. To keep costs low, the airline bought many used aircraft from around the world. At the time ValuJet's fleet was among the oldest in the United States, averaging 26 years. In 1995, the airline sued Delta Air Lines and TWA over landing slots.[4]
ValuJet took aggressive measures to hold down operating costs. Its employees were paid well below prevailing market costs. The airline did not own any hangars or spare parts inventories. ValuJet also required pilots to pay for their own training and only paid them after completed flights. It also gave flight attendants only bare-bones training. It also outsourced many functions other airlines handle themselves. For instance, it subcontracted maintenance to several companies, and these companies in turn subcontracted the work to other companies. Whenever delays were caused by mechanics, ValuJet cut the pay of the mechanics working on that plane. [5][6]
Safety problems

In August 1995, the Department of Defense (DoD) rejected ValuJet's bid to fly military personnel. In a scathing report, the DoD cited serious deficiencies in ValuJet's quality assurance procedures.[5]
The Federal Aviation Administration's (FAA) Atlanta field office sent a memo on February 14, 1996, to Washington, D.C., stating that "consideration should be given to an immediate FAR-121 re-certification of this airline" - in other words, the FAA wanted ValuJet grounded. ValuJet airplanes made 15 emergency landings in 1994, 57 in 1995, and 57 from January through May 1996. In February the FAA ordered ValuJet to seek approval before adding any new aircraft or cities to their network, something the industry had not seen since deregulation in 1979. This attempt at removing ValuJet's certification was "lost in the maze at FAA" according to NTSB Chairman Jim Hall.[7] By this time, ValuJet's accident rate was not only one of the highest in the low-fare sector, but was more than 14 times that of the legacy airlines.[5]

The reason for the post is simply to warn prospective applicants of what to expect if they come to Allegiant. Our company is willing to staff its cockpits with virtual street captains in order to fulfill it's goal of extreme flexibility. This prospect will undoubtedly draw a lot of interest and applicants should be made aware of the reasons that our senior first officers are declining the upgrade.

Yes, many of our pilots are looking elsewhere (if not most), but it takes time. Many are leaving and the exodus is accelerating. Thankfully, even those that are leaving are still fighting the fight, not only for the sake of allegiant pilots, but for our profession as a whole. These guys realize this battle is much bigger than us and they must take a stand to avoid this sludge washing up on the doorstep of their next gig.

Instead of bickering, pilots of this profession should be thanking these guys, supporting them as they fight the same race-to-the-bottom that others have fought before them. We are in this together against the never ending litany of a$$-clowns looking to change our profession because "they are different".

Left to their own devices, these con-artists will continue lowering the bar, setting the 'new standard' for this profession. Watch out then as other CEOs will look to emulate these Wall Street Cinderellas and their cost-gutting tactics. They can't help themselves.

As someone who worked there for 4 years and left I can say all this (and more) is true. Like I tell everyone who asks me it's a good job if you have NO job (bc it's a paycheck) but if you have a job it's not worth it.

Every Allegiant guy/gal I have met are good people. The best friends I have in aviation were from the worst jobs. Comraderie makes it doable. Keep the faith.

Actually, I think that the view of industry hiring is pretty rosy if YOU already have one of the plum jobs. The truth of the matter is not everyone is going to get a major airline job.

Let me repeat that for the willfully obtuse:

NOT EVERYONE WILL GET A MAJOR AIRLINE JOB.

Compare the number of ATPs with the number of available major airline jobs. Even the dullest math student can figure it out. It amazes me a Delta pilot can't.

Thank you. Since he's previous military, he really has no clue.

+1 Best folks I ever flew with and still keep in touch with

The parallels are jaw dropping. Anyone other than the President and CEO would quickly recognize the alarming similarities. They don't see it because they don't take any responsibility for what happened at ValuJet. They blame everyone except themselves. Nonetheless, here they are again, proceeding unabated with the exact same philosophies and mindless, cut-through-the-bone business practices that resulted in the last disaster. Like ValuJet, Wall Street will love them and the feds will be powerless until the inevitable happens again. I really hope I'm wrong.

They very masterfully distanced themselves in valujet by outsourcing the maintenance. Wasn’t ValuJet per se that put those canisters on the airplane. Plausible deniability is the name of the game for these cats.

It's also interesting how management works for the "Travel company" shell, pilots for work for the "airline" shell, IT I think has it's own shell. The airplanes aren't even owned by the "Travel company" or the "Airline" but a shell corporation that leases the planes out to the "Airline" shell......:eek:

Absolutely. I agree 100%.

Hopefully a contract will come sooner than later, and Allegiant will become a decent place to be again. Might take some self help, but I think it's the only way this management team will listen. Go get 'em guys.

I think your quote says everything that need be said about you.

Have a wonderful weekend.